From owner-freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Thu Dec 7 16:11:03 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B0BAE8B775 for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (unknown [127.0.1.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74A1A6B7AA for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) id 73FF7E8B774; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:03 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73A84E8B773 for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [96.47.72.132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2AE896B7A9; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 1235) id 703285966; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:11:02 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2017 17:11:02 +0100 From: Baptiste Daroussin To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Cy Schubert , "cem@freebsd.org" , gjb@freebsd.org, "Pokala, Ravi" , ghapiro@freebsd.org, "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" , Cy Schubert Subject: Re: Sendmail deprecation ? Message-ID: <20171207161102.cy4d3y6a2qm6w74f@ivaldir.net> References: <201712070348.vB73mesl095194@slippy.cwsent.com> <201712071532.vB7FWb4A062722@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="bwltqmbjuauk2qsm" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201712071532.vB7FWb4A062722@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> User-Agent: NeoMutt/20171027 X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2017 16:11:03 -0000 --bwltqmbjuauk2qsm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Dec 07, 2017 at 07:32:37AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > In message <201712070251.vB72p58k054508@slippy.cwsent.com>, Cy Schubert= =20 > > writes: > > > In message , "Pokal= a,=20 > > > Ravi" w > > > rites: > > > > So less "no dma(8)", and more "no default MTA at all; make them sel= ect one" > > > ? > > > > > > Yes. > >=20 > > Thinking about this further and softening my position a little, I'd be= =20 > > satisfied with a knob to not build dma in base at all. (Though the desi= re=20 > > to remove bloat I prefer not to replace when something is removed.) > >=20 > > Upline sendmail hasn't been updated for a a year and almost eight month= s.=20 > > (I had misgivings of the sale.) Having said that, I think sendmail's ti= me=20 > > has come however I'm not convinced replacing it with another default MT= A is=20 > > the solution. A stub like pkg that could install a package, providing t= he=20 > > user with a list to choose from, possibly timing out after a short peri= od=20 > > of time to install the dma pkg (or port) makes the most sense to me and= =20 > > should be a good compromise for all. > >=20 > > As gjb@ has been working toward packaged base, would it not be a good t= ime=20 > > for the MTA replacement project to consider relying on dma ports/packag= es? > >=20 > > Ports/packages are just as much FreeBSD as base is. >=20 > Why do we not just wait for pkg base? =20 >=20 > These silly threads on "axe this" are just waisting time that should be > spent on getting pkg base done and then these issues become pretty much > a /dev/null. >=20 First this is totally unrelated. Second pkg base is very far from being ready, lots of work is needed to get= it ready for users, and this thread is not taking time at all from the time sp= ent on getting pkg base. Have you noticed the sender of this request is also on= e who have spent a lot of time in packaging base? I can tell you these issues won't become pretty much a /dev/null once packa= ging base is there. In particular in the case of sendmail, it can btw actually s= ave time on packaging base, but that is another story... It would be nice to not call others work silly, you are the first to ask for people to actually follow a deprecation procedure and when they do you call= it "silly"? 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