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To: obrien@NUXI.com (David O'Brien)
cc: CVS-committers@freefall.freebsd.org, cvs-all@freefall.freebsd.org,
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Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/contrib/gcc/config/i386 freebsd-elf.h freebsd.h 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 16 Feb 1997 23:06:46 PST."
             <19970216230646.YW60212@dragon.nuxi.com> 
Date: Sun, 16 Feb 1997 23:25:10 -0800
From: Paul Traina <pst@shockwave.com>
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  From: obrien@NUXI.com (David O'Brien)
  Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/contrib/gcc/config/i386 freebsd-elf.h freebsd.h
  Paul Traina writes:
  > I think you have likely already been yelled at for this, 
  
  Actually, you are only the second... I expected more.
  
  > It's utterly bogus to add this symbol into gcc as a predefined symbol
  > because MOST 4.4 bsd systems don't have it.
  
  Ok, then how about "__post_44bsd__".
   
  > The real way to figure out if you're on a late-model BSD system is to inclu
>>de
  > sys/param.h and check for BSD >= datecode.
  
  Yes, but people simply don't do that.  If anybody can offer a guarenteed
  way to include <sys/param.h> w/o needing to defined something like
  HAVE_SYS_PARAM_H in the Makefile, I'll switch all ports over to that.
  There has been a discussion in the ports list about this.

Yeah, I know.  Unfortunately, we don't get to play god, otherwise I would
have done this several years ago.  The rules are to use param.h, and to
add HAVE_SYS_PARAM_H type code to every application you build with.  I
don't like those rules either,  but that's the facts of life.  Anything
else sucks.
  
  We can be high and mightly and tell people they *will* use the BSD macro
  in <sys/param.h>, but it simply doesn't happen.  The masses use
  __FreeBSD__ whether we like it or not.  I want something that covers
  FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, BSDI.  "#if defined(__FreeBSD__) ||
  defined(__OpenBSD__) ... " is simply ludicrist.

Yes, I agree with you there.  I've wanted this fixed for ages.

Get Free, Open, Net, and BSDI to agree on something COMMON and we can
take it from there.  If you do something unilaterally, you just add more
confusion.