From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Sep 15 20:53:55 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EA05106566C for ; Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:53:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bright@elvis.mu.org) Received: from elvis.mu.org (elvis.mu.org [192.203.228.196]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 486DA8FC12 for ; Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:53:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: by elvis.mu.org (Postfix, from userid 1192) id 3C7DA1A3DC7; Sat, 15 Sep 2012 13:53:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2012 13:53:49 -0700 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Eitan Adler Message-ID: <20120915205349.GF34563@elvis.mu.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Fallout from the CVS discussion X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:53:55 -0000 This sounds like a plan. I apologize if my mail wasn't clear, it was jokish in nature. To clarify: I firmly support removal of CVS from HEAD. I'm also a bit troubled that something that makes so much sense blew up into such a large discussion. -Alfred * Eitan Adler [120915 13:39] wrote: > Hi everyone, > > After the 90+ email thread this is my take on the CVS discussion: > > Here is a summary of people that support CVS's removal now: > > Eitan Adler > Peter Jeremy > Bryan Drewery > Tim Kientzle > Poul-Henning Kamp > Joel Dahl > Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav > Paul Schenkeveld > Baptiste Daroussin > Doug Barton > Lars Engels > Markiyan Kushnir > > Here is a summary of people that support CVS's eventual removal, but > want to wait for some time: > > Warner Losh > Erich Dollansky > Bjoern A. Zeeb > Garance A Drosehn > > Here is a summary of people that prefer not to remove CVS at all (or > at least, specifically not for 10.0): > > Olli Hauer > Julian H. Stacey > > Here are people that commented, whose opinion I did not see stated: > > Lev Serebryakov > Glen Barber > Ian Lepore > Adrian Chadd > Giovanni Trematerra > Alfred Perlstein > Jeffrey Bouquet > Marius Strobl > > I believe the overwhelming majority of people commenting support the > removal of CVS from base at some point before 10.0. As such I think it > is correct to do so. > > I see following reasons to keep CVS brought up in the : > > - we still have some CVS infrastructure > - lots of users still use the CVS infrastructure > - Some users rely on CVS on machines which can't install ports > - We don't have a complete subversion infrastructure ready > - CVS has been traditionally installed on unix systems > > However, -CURRENT is not meant to be a production system. Users > running -current are expected to follow the mailing lists, debug > systems, and deal with tool changes. In particular these are the exact > users capable of dealing with the above issues. In addition waiting to > remove CVS delays the amount of time users will have to learn the "new > world order," to find hidden dependencies on CVS, etc. There is a port > (and package) available for CVS. CVS is not something not ordinarily > needed by embedded systems, so concerns about the inability to use > ports are minimal. > > My plan is to wait for some of the existing objections to be solved > and then go ahead with the removal. > > In particular I will not remove CVS until > > (a) Documentation has been updated to the new svn for src, ports, www and doc > (b) We create a 'changes between 9 and 10 list' and put this removal on it. > In particular this document should well advertised (and possibly be a > subset of the release notes) > (c) We are sure the svn mirrors are sufficient enough for users both > in the United States and in other countries. > > In particular I will *not* be waiting for: > > (i) cvsup to die > (ii) a complete lack of CVS users. > > The discussion has resulted in some very useful ideas and feedback > and I'd like to thank everyone who participated. > If you have additional objections please followup with me *privately*. > Other than this email, I will let the topic rest until such time as > the first three conditions are met. > > > -- > Eitan Adler > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-arch@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-arch > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-arch-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- - Alfred Perlstein .- VMOA #5191, 03 vmax, 92 gs500, 85 ch250, 07 zx10 .- FreeBSD committer