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Date:      Mon, 18 Jul 2011 15:51:55 +0100
From:      Frank Shute <frank@shute.org.uk>
To:        Polytropon <freebsd@edvax.de>
Cc:        FreeBSD <freebsd-questions@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: Lennart Poettering: BSD Isn't Relevant Anymore
Message-ID:  <20110718145155.GA77041@orange.esperance-linux.co.uk>
In-Reply-To: <20110718134903.993b87f5.freebsd@edvax.de>
References:  <20110717071059.25971662@scorpio> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1107170928360.56712@Elmer.dco.penx.com> <CAKYr3zx3C5kwUaZQ82=d8U=uCRusoNHc4qbb0w-8BNB2X2Xu9Q@mail.gmail.com> <CA+tpaK2-t2Y5NN+1XFa8aJbw+bfvEAeP4-iD5_iLthqaohydNw@mail.gmail.com> <CAKYr3zweDWHCT9ir4uqq+jPUZaHZE+NdgUuu_vvbcOy65XDvBA@mail.gmail.com> <CA+tpaK3w7ZTpSJgsqkz+oBwbvm6J6vi4TyFBSqMxB5gDbsH9oA@mail.gmail.com> <4E23F31C.3010803@pathscale.com> <20110718073000.29e89590@scorpio> <20110718134903.993b87f5.freebsd@edvax.de>

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On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 01:49:03PM +0200, Polytropon wrote:
>
> On Mon, 18 Jul 2011 07:30:00 -0400, Jerry wrote:
> > I suggested several years ago, and I will re-suggest that FreeBSD start
> > a program that would allow programmers to be paid to write code that
> > either the regular contributors do not want to write or are not capable
> > of writing. Other OS's are currently working on that model. No one
> > would be forced to contribute. This would prove beneficial to everyone
> > and should satisfy both capitalist who don't mind paying for quality
> > products and socialist like Poly who want everything for nothing. It
> > would be a win-win situation.
>=20
> Erm... you're invited to prove the "everything for nothing"
> as well as the "socialist" claim. I'm old enough not to
> take this insult personally, but still (for maintaining
> discussion culture) please back up your statement, or it
> will simply classify you as impolite and stupid.
>=20
> Besides that nonsense, I agree with your statement. With
> support (usually by money) and help of manufacturers that
> are interested in bringing their hardware to a better
> support situation by providing information and documentation
> so developers could write drivers for many platforms, it
> would be a win-win situation. It would even be better than
> cost-intensive reverse engineering - means: better drivers
> in less time, so FreeBSD could be used on most modern
> hardware. The more standards are used, the less work is
> needed to bring the new hardware up. (Just imagine you
> would need a driver for a hard disk...)
>=20
> Personally, this is no issue for me as I don't own such
> things, but because you claim that I "want everything for
> nothing"... :-) Keep in mind that I've also spent money
> on software, but on one that WORKS.
>=20
> Maybe this could even affect the whole *BSD family, so
> by the availability of more drivers, more desktop share
> could be gained, which seems to be the measurement of
> OS quality today.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> > With the advent of the next version of FBSD soon to be upon us,
> > this would be a propitious moment to start such a project. FBSD has
> > never been considered a dreadnought in the driver development field and
> > this might work to change that.
>=20
> The idea seems to have lots of potential. With paid
> developers who are willing to license their work as
> BSDL code, it could really improve the "out of the box
> support" of the system.
>=20
> On the other hand - as you mentioned -, it may be
> the lack of support of the community, but THAT is
> the main force behind FreeBSD. Other operating systems
> have big companies behind them who are able and willing
> to spend money on "prestige projects", as well as their
> everyday work because they need to make their living from
> it - or gain world domination. :-)
>=20
> The more the FreeBSD community depends on having certain
> hardware working, the more support I see for developers.
> But as the community seems to be spread across all the
> many forms of OS use (mostly servers, but also stationary
> workstations, just a minority seems to be using mobile
> devices), I'm not sure it will be sufficient. It's not
> that FreeBSD is a "desktop-only OS" which can invest all
> its energy in getting commodity hardware working, while
> leaving quality aside on other fields. Poorly implemented
> features, broken code, messing around with quirks and
> short-time solutions do not seem to be very welcome among
> FreeBSD users.
>=20

I like Jerry's proposal. The FreeBSD Foundation should organise their
donations page so that you can donate to various different areas of
development like TUG do:

https://www.tug.org/donate.html

It should be at least split into server, workstation and general
development.

I donate to both FreeBSD and TUG but I far prefer the TUG model. When
I donate to the Foundation, I know a lot of my money is going to
esoteric server development which doesn't benefit me much but benefits
large corporations who can afford to fund their own development to
scratch *their own* itches. I want mine scratched!


Regards,


--=20

 Frank

 Contact info: http://www.shute.org.uk/misc/contact.html



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