Date: 04 Jan 2003 20:20:56 -0800 From: swear@attbi.com (Gary W. Swearingen) To: Brett Glass <brett@lariat.org> Cc: swear@attbi.com (Gary W. Swearingen), Mike Jeays <mj001@rogers.com>, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Bystander shot by a spam filter. Message-ID: <lkwulkmdlj.ulk@localhost.localdomain> In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20030104193110.0285a570@localhost> References: <4.3.2.7.2.20030104145840.02925620@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20030104131212.03837e10@localhost> <3E120659.3D60EB30@mindspring.com> <200212312041.gBVKfr183480@hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org> <3E120659.3D60EB30@mindspring.com> <4.3.2.7.2.20030104112015.026a5530@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20030104131212.03837e10@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20030104145840.02925620@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20030104193110.0285a570@localhost>
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Brett Glass <brett@lariat.org> writes: > At 06:27 PM 1/4/2003, Gary W. Swearingen wrote: [snip] > > Well, we know where to find the bad in GPLed code: in the license. > Unfortunately, the only legal way to un-GNU it is to re-implement > from scratch or do clean room reverse engineering. We can't take > the law into our own hands and kill the bad guys. (Too messy. ;-) But you don't NEED to un-GNU it for many purposes. While copyleft code is worthless (and so not a free gift) for some purposes (eg, close-combining with non-GPL code), it still has value as a free gift for some purposes, like when executing or when a copy is sold on a CDROM, etc. It's a gift; just not as much of a gift as if it were under a better license. > It's effectively servitude, in that by using the code FreeBSD is > doing Stallman's bidding and promoting his agenda. "Servitude" is lack of freedom or involuntary service, neither of which is implied by their "doing" or "promoting" anything. > The GPL is more than "restrictive." It's viral, discriminatory, and > aimed right at programmers' livelihoods. And how is any closed-source license better? I don't hear you blasting closed-source licensors just for their nasty licenses. BTW, the GPL was aimed at software PUBLISHER's livelihoods. RMS envisaged programmers being paid to write software, not being paid to let people use their software. Few own what they write anyway. The impact on programmers' pocket books is debatable but I can't argue it. His other goal was to improve progammers' livelihoods, in some sense, by permitting them to avoid re-inventing the wheel for each company and to patch broken software. That might help the industry enough to improve the programmer's pocketbook, but maybe with fewer of them. It's also debatable whether that's a good thing or not. > >And sadly, most DEVELOPERS > >soon catch on to and agree with the agenda, buying the over- > >simplification that it's only fair that "if I can't use your source, > >you can't use mine", as if all chunks of source are of equal value. > > And as if ALL of yours is worth one line of GPLed code. Well, all of your work within the derivative work, yes. > >Old Germans haven't found everyone as forgiving as you. But I get your > >point. It's hard to blame individuals for choosing their own short- > >term interests, even if it'll cost their group (and others) dearly in > >the long run. > > It's one of the key strategies of malevolent people -- and always has > been -- to play people's perceived short term interests off against their > long term ones. But I'm not ready to say that it's a necessarily malevolent strategy, even when only the strategist knows the eventual outcome, like when the people should have known better if they were paying attention. I forgot to say that the individuals deserve some blame none-the-less; sacrifice deserves praise while cowardice and laziness deserve scorn -- in order to encourage the former and discourage the latter. But it's a bit Quixotic to think one can influence other's software (or political) selections, I suppose. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message
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