Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 00:00:39 -0500 From: Allan Jude <freebsd@allanjude.com> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: RFC: deprecation of nve(4) in 10-STABLE and removal from 11-CURRENT Message-ID: <52F46877.8020504@allanjude.com> In-Reply-To: <201402070318.s173Ijvb048532@fire.js.berklix.net> References: <201402070318.s173Ijvb048532@fire.js.berklix.net>
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This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --eMcxplvG1vijLvOeqU3l76FDhEmXC5ou6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2014-02-06 22:18, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > Hi, Reference: >> From: David Chisnall <theraven@freebsd.org> >> Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 18:52:43 +0000 >=20 > David Chisnall wrote: >> On 6 Feb 2014, at 18:34, Julian H. Stacey <jhs@berklix.com> wrote: >> >>> Best avoid the obscure word `Deprecated' in manuals: >>> It's not common/ plain English. Maybe a geek import, or USA >>> dialect ? It's not easily internationaly understood English. >>> Best make manuals easier for non native English speakers (& native >>> English too ;-). I am British born & bred, whether in English >>> speaking circles in UK or Germany I never hear or read 'deprecated' >>> unless its in BSD context. Few native English speakers I know will = be >>> immediately sure of the meaning, it's too obscure. >> >> I'd strongly disagree with this. Deprecated is, perhaps, only in comm= on use as jargon, but it's very widespread within the tech field. I don'= t think I've ever read an API reference that doesn't include the word, fo= r example, and it's even a keyword in many code documentation tools. For= example, JavaDoc supports @deprecated and gcc / clang include an __attri= bute__((deprecated)) that generates a compile-time warning whenever anyon= e tries to call a deprecated function. =20 >> >> I've not come across the word outside of tech uses, but I've also not = come across the term network interface outside of tech circles. Deprecat= ed, in this use, may be jargon, but it's very widespread jargon, and requ= esting it not be used sounds like asking for words like driver or process= or also be avoided. >> >> David >> (Also a native English speaker, although familiar with the unofficial = fork from Leftpondia) >=20 > Uh Huh ;-) http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Leftpondia > American 1620 fork of English deduced. > 1620: When a Mayflower butter maid Deprecated a milk maid giving 20 o= unces > to a pint, & confused USA liquids down to 16 ounces. (Beware man uni= ts). >=20 > Amerian is not always best international English. It's a big early > variant of English, but other native English speakers round the > globe well outnumber American I believe. (Start with a map of the > Commonwealth), & many 2nd language people too will help define > international English, (as Jos=E9 Manuel Barroso, EU commission > president, said), not just natives, eg British or Americans etc, > will get to shape international English. >=20 > Americans often seem to find it harder to grasp what's internationaly > portable English, as opposed to American, perhaps because a large > country makes a higher percentage of language experience internal > national usage. >=20 > FreeBSD's manual writers, especially non native English manual > writers, should not copy Americanisms &/or bad nomenclature from > one manual to another, but ask themselves if they know better words, > to make it easier also for other non native English to read. eg > Deprecated is not common English. >=20 > PS Light relief: http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20140206-can-drones-be= -hacked >=20 > Cheers, > Julian >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.o= rg" >=20 The problem with 'deprecated' is that it often means 'this is no longer the suggested way to do it', not necessarily 'this method of doing it will soon cease working'. For example, in /etc/rc.conf ifconfig_em0_aliasX is deprecated But it still works, and as far as I am aware, there are no plans to stop supporting it, it is just 'recommended', that you use ipv4_addrs_em0 I think the word deprecated is fine, but it should also be made clear that nve is going away and that you should switch to nfe immediately. --=20 Allan Jude --eMcxplvG1vijLvOeqU3l76FDhEmXC5ou6 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJS9Gh6AAoJEJrBFpNRJZKfiWYQAJbBZdbFwgKa6U1slTNWnBOs Q3flC4cYlq1BYEOb2RSye35ETBbyz2oUrqcZ2ey7/xzQ0rmjGLjBj7kWz5MIxFDN TWKN8+6KIbmzj2894QciDh7mAOJKHCGi2o2+IJUo3jP1dVTHj0iwTp5sUipwBzpY KEXNESN73pGfbnkxtOk+cOxROkHRkH5mQe3WHOjvVkeJa09di/5CFVAqaA6WKLVd Vo9L1Hl1/GjzEExs+H3J3aPvvm1c92iyPsgM8RckBt+2I48a8HOpgesJSzZ8NVMV eNQapGeGsZv07dlIf4TxtbhWbHm/wLs+tGoODYUauHdJSjRRMFaqCwR5/bS4w+Bw Npc1wN2KkztX+vaS07as4rpt4to9Dg3cX65o6tK8Sf9DRtXcE8A4a2zvf5g6gkno feSJAJXvk19pFfX4CXNNuefSR+Ka+55Q/sfJYepKMECLG+IL/t9obqDZETvs3t66 RjFYsC+51ET7PjhtmNpDpBXdmLNkPdXcj8uV8RPk+Focvi2mSDH7rAI7hQ5s6Ank H90xiUT7d3NblWmSy6al4ra9+lgY5azNSNHbz9RGEYTsq6wpz48tyDearE0l9OAz +vc5ttK8ncex9fvX214RWtIA0IEUIMbtxxNpPn6iKttL5+6p316gYDG+n5NNOeRM 9P0XjnrduYTQs2R6PH2v =uwJT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --eMcxplvG1vijLvOeqU3l76FDhEmXC5ou6--
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