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Date:      Wed, 10 Jul 1996 18:27:43 -0700
From:      "Jordan K. Hubbard" <jkh@time.cdrom.com>
To:        Joe Greco <jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com>
Cc:        hackers@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Some recent changes to GENERIC 
Message-ID:  <6096.837048463@time.cdrom.com>
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 10 Jul 1996 12:18:26 CDT." <199607101718.MAA25879@brasil.moneng.mei.com> 

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> However, read my lips:  NEWBIES ARE FRIGHTENED BY THE PROSPECT OF
> RECOMPILING KERNELS AND OTHER GURUISH CRAP.  It needs to work cleanly
> out of the box if we are to have any market appeal.  GENERIC probably 
> runs on 80% of all FreeBSD boxes out there, I would bet.  Hey, I even
> run GENERIC on some of my systems.  It's convenient.  It's flexible.
> It's the default, too.

Ok, Joe, I'm going to put back sio2 and sio3 for you, OK?

But I'll also tell you that your argument above is more or less total
crapola.  Doing their own kernel build is HARDLY something that I'm
even going to spare even a recognisable fraction of those users who
will be forced in 2.1.5 to build their own kernels, whether or not
sio2 and sio3 are back (you never owned a sound card, Joe?).  I
furthermore seriously doubt that most people will have 4 serial ports
enabled for general use and your claims that the world is a 4-port
place are entirely inconsistent with my own experience - I think
you've fabricated facts rather wildly here in an attempt to support
your case.

In other words, I don't think it's going to make any truly TANGIBLE
difference in the amount of trouble people go through with custom
kernels, and your arguments miss the mark entirely if you think you've
somehow saved the world by getting me to bring back two lousy serial
devices.

However, you seem to have a lot of passionate feelings where this is
concerned so I'll tell you what: Do something genuinely meaningful
about it rather than thinking that you've done your side of the
argument proud simply by getting me to put two silly serial devices
back.  What would be meaningful?

Write a kernel configuration front-end that does it all via
configuration menus and popup dialog boxes, or set about finishing the
infrastructure that Julian started in /usr/src/release to allow
independant folks to easily build custom boot floppies for users with
sound cards, frame grabbers, what have you.  In short, direct all of
those strong feelings in a more productive direction that genuinely
moves us FORWARD on this issue and I'll say to myself "My my, so Joe
Greco actually *does* put his money where his mouth is!  I guess I was
totally wrong about him being just yet another whining pedant!" :-)

					Jordan



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