From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Jul 5 02:38:07 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D9C21065675 for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 02:38:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pisymbol@gmail.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.184]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1AAF8FC17 for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 02:38:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pisymbol@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id h3so501331nfh.33 for ; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 19:38:05 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=vicWfVkQpO3MCTxgFZUclhFGw4X5BCC6JWXWMybdecw=; b=Ckp6BAGdFSs5aDrWguLLDwcvtonfhbZpdOufmWiLwAVyGTHvkyQXm3FGLN8dmR9DC2 wDVj2LcNGODyBM6QhlhAPembpgw2phEoYjiawuTef3CNLIXPFkxRm2P/8iBJoGfHaVz8 PDcTYQvEL5O0jsaD0rsieWX15gXeMeIFgKTw8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=pEu7bv4d0IdKOZydCSGfED4yJ5zXGgmo4Rvj/kUCTVHmuE3jsHQquUf+tVJXV4ynIt 42TslWqQG5hSYA9i0xmPso4g68iQpyEGJDPj3UgxVR6GiYNIyzvJTzH721gBAdRyJx5P 8argGGFmPlyKzJjOGqRgvw9yaf04ESs8ooQQU= Received: by 10.210.141.4 with SMTP id o4mr852307ebd.59.1215225484134; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 19:38:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.210.34.1 with HTTP; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 19:38:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3c0b01820807041938w619caa44of154de91dac1beb4@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 22:38:04 -0400 From: "Alexander Sack" To: "Mike Meyer" In-Reply-To: <20080704202744.083436a4@bhuda.mired.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20080704124227.GA10264@rebelion.Sisis.de> <20080704164015.514425fd@bhuda.mired.org> <3c0b01820807041712l39bdafd8sf3914c2b462023c6@mail.gmail.com> <20080704202744.083436a4@bhuda.mired.org> Cc: Matthias Apitz , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, guru@unixarea.de, Mike Meyer Subject: Re: kernel HEAD && userland 7.0-REL? X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 05 Jul 2008 02:38:07 -0000 On Fri, Jul 4, 2008 at 8:27 PM, Mike Meyer wrote: > On Fri, 4 Jul 2008 20:12:58 -0400 > "Alexander Sack" wrote: > >> On Fri, Jul 4, 2008 at 4:40 PM, Mike Meyer >> wrote: >> > On Fri, 4 Jul 2008 14:42:27 +0200 >> > Matthias Apitz wrote: >> >> I'm running a RELENG_7 kernel and a userland as 7.0-REL on one of my >> >> laptops; I've been asked to check if a given driver problem in RELENG_7 is as >> >> well with HEAD... can I update the kernel to HEAD and let the userland >> >> (and all my compiled ports) as 7.0-REL; I know that this is not the >> >> intention, but it would cost me a lot of work if I should compile as >> >> well ~200 ports.... >> > >> > When you say HEAD, do you mean the HEAD of 8-CURRENT or 7-STABLE? In >> > either case whether or not it works depends on whether something has >> > changed in the kernel that has a required userland change. >> > >> > On the other hand, if you mean 7-STABLE, then the ports should work >> > properly whether userland does or not. >> >> As a note, I just recently used HEAD on a 7_STABLE box to test changes >> recently to re for an updated PCIe revision NIC card on my Eee Box. >> It worked fine (both runtime and my NIC which I then patched my >> 7_STABLE tree which also worked, yea!). In a thread I started about >> cross platform building, it seems that historically FreeBSD has had a >> very stable ABI allowing multiple kernels to run underneath different >> versions of user land (this is certainly not the case for all *NIX >> variants). > > So stable that the things that break when you try and do this have > made it into the FAQ: > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/faq/troubleshoot.html#NLIST-FAILED > > Personally, I managed to try this once when the console driver needed > a termcap entry change as well :-(. Oh c'mon now....if this is the worst of your problems, then you're doing pretty darn good. I believe Linux binaries rely on the version of glibc, an aux vec entry, and the way the kernel was actually built to figure out whether to use syscall or int to hop into the kernel. I mean things could be a lot worse!! :D! -aps