Date: Wed, 08 Oct 1997 09:15:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Simon Shapiro <Shimon@i-Connect.Net> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" <jkh@time.cdrom.com> Cc: "Matthew D. Fuller" <fullermd@futuresouth.com>, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: group assignments from make world. Message-ID: <XFMail.971008091548.Shimon@i-Connect.Net> In-Reply-To: <24410.876303929@time.cdrom.com>
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Hi "Jordan K. Hubbard"; On 08-Oct-97 you wrote: > > I also see something else; Many times a question will trigger a > > discussion > > that end up way out (compared to the original subject). This is good, > > I > > think, but increases the volume on the lists. > > Yes. I'm all for discussion but the volume really has gotten to be > just a bit much and the percentage of useful info we developers glean > from the interaction is decreasing. That's bad since it will only > lead to the abandonment of these lists by that same developer crowd - > it's been months since I was last able to subscribe to freebsd-isp or > freebsd-questions, for example, and I think freebsd-hackers is going > to be the next to go for me. Sigh. I agree there is a problem needing solution. I am just a bit worried about how I (and others like me) surface our isues, which are typically development issues. Sometimes technical in nature, sometimes ``how-to'' in nature, and sometimes administrative in nature. Beyond that, You raised the question of control. How do you restrict, without offense, the traffic? > > If you are to categorize access, how will you do that? Will you > > restrict > > some? Based on what criteria? > > I guess if I we could get everyone on the bleeding edge (e.g. tracking > a branch vs hanging out at the last release) to subscribe to the right > mailing lists and also be _very aware_ that they were about to do the > equivalent of hang gliding off of Everest and if they run into > trouble, they're basically on their own. This I do not understand. One of the major reasons for working on a project like this, in a professional (vs. hobby, serious as it may be) capacity, is the open access to the development crew. Let me illustrate, using myself (and ignoring my diificult personality). Belive me, I am not alone, although exceptionally noisy :-) I came to take interest in FreeBSD from measurable experience in these matters, but no FreeBSD experience and very little bsd experience. I had/have questions that ranged from ``Where do I start?'' through basic API questions, to theoretical questions. What is attractive in ``free'' O/S projects is that I can surface these questions almost anonymously and get an answer. Today, I hope, I know the answers to many of these questions, but still see this forum as vital. Maybe a part of the problem can be illustrated in threads like ``The best PCI Ethernet Card''. It has been running for weeks. I do not doubt the value of the question, but where is the answer? Burried somewhere in this thread. Does this question belong in the hackers list in the first place? Probably not, but this is the best forum to surface the question. Maybe the answer lies in moving threads like this, quickly, to another channel. Maybe a chat list, or maybe a mechanism where a new mailing list can be spawned off for this type ofdiscussion, removing it automatically 10 days after the last posting. > > I think you should chalk this issue up to ``cost of doing busines''. > > I have been, believe me, but that cost is rising every day. I'm not > sure we can afford it forever and still remain the project everyone > wants us to be. I am in 100% agreement that a solution is needed. Maybe a moderator that redirects threads off the wrong list (without serializing all traffic through this moderator) by posting ``Hey, this subject should/must/IS moved to such and such list. If self policing does not work, then reorganize, but carefully please. Simon
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