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Date:      Sat, 26 Jan 2019 15:28:45 -0500
From:      Chris Gordon <freebsd@theory14.net>
To:        FreeBSD <freebsd-questions@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: Wireless interface
Message-ID:  <6263E0A8-BF3A-4287-A161-9DC973562A69@theory14.net>
In-Reply-To: <MWHPR04MB04954E8E691D98C40B68607780940@MWHPR04MB0495.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References:  <CAPu-kW-0u=Eoj8NtASnD_WDnsosj_WcTEh=Zhby1DnBV3d2rdg@mail.gmail.com> <MWHPR04MB04954E8E691D98C40B68607780940@MWHPR04MB0495.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

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> On Jan 26, 2019, at 1:50 PM, Carmel NY <carmel_ny@outlook.com> wrote:
>=20
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 09:54:05 -0600, Rob Belics stated:
>=20
>>> It is situations like this that make me love
>>> Microsoft. Connecting a wireless network should not require user
>>> intervention other than choosing the network and entering the
>>> password. =20
>>=20
>> FreeBSD is not a consumer operating system. It's not designed to hand
>> hold anyone. That is why Windows is such a huge monstrosity of an
>> install.
>=20
> I just finished a fresh install of Windows 10. If you take the time
> involved in installing a basic MS Windows system vs. a basic FreeBSD
> system, Windows will usually win. A big plus is that Windows actually
> can get a wireless system up and running by itself, sans perhaps
> supplying the password. Does FreeBSD even support using the WPS Button
> on the Wi-Fi Router? Plus, you then have to install a GUI. Now, if you
> want to compare a FreeBSD system sans GUI, you have to compare it
> against a MS Server, not the regular Windows version design for home =
or
> office users.
>=20
> This is not about "hand-holding"; it is about bring the OS into the
> modern age. My machine is supposed to be my slave, not the other way
> around.
>=20
> Thanks for your comment anyway.

I think you hit the nail on the head of comparing FreeBSD more to =
Windows Server versions than the consumer desktop/laptop systems -- =
I=E2=80=99ll call these end user systems.  That is the better analog and =
what I think Rob was trying to convey.  Things that are valuable and =
desirable on a server may not be so on an end user system and vice =
versa.  These are two different sets optimizations which often conflict =
with each other.  For instance, a GUI is most often preferred on an end =
user system whereas it=E2=80=99s more of a liability on a server =
(remember that in 2008  the =E2=80=9CServer Core=E2=80=9D in Windows =
Server 2008 finally introduced a server sans GUI -- something UNIX has =
had since the 1970s... ;) ).

Now this isn=E2=80=99t to say you can=E2=80=99t use any of the =
particular operating systems for either end user or server functions, =
but in doing so you will need to compensate for the gap between the =
primary design purpose of the system and your use of the system.  =
Consider if you wanted to run a farm of servers with Windows 10 (not the =
Windows Server, but the consumer desktop version).  You could do it, but =
you=E2=80=99d probably be longing for design and implementation choices =
that are made for an operating system focused at being a server.  Doing =
the opposite results in some of the frustrations you=E2=80=99re having.  =
There are plenty of people that use FreeBSD as an end user system (and =
work continues to improve the experience), but they also understand that =
they must bridge the gaps between server design choices and what they =
want from an end user system. =20

If you want to use FreeBSD as an end user system, I think the community =
welcomes you and is more than happy to help out.  Just understand that =
it may take a bit more work than something purpose built to be purely an =
end user system.  Conversely if you want to run a server (or many =
servers), I think you=E2=80=99d be pleasantly surprised at how well =
suited FreeBSD is for that purpose (and the community will also welcome =
you), especially when compared to trying to use an end user system for =
that function.

I hope that helps explain things a bit more.=20

Chris=



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