From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 7 07:29:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA16918 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 7 Jan 1995 07:29:16 -0800 Received: from plains.NoDak.edu (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA16910 for ; Sat, 7 Jan 1995 07:29:15 -0800 Received: by plains.NoDak.edu; Sat, 7 Jan 1995 09:29:07 -0600 Date: Sat, 7 Jan 1995 09:29:07 -0600 From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199501071529.AA16555@plains.NoDak.edu> To: hackers@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: guest account: Yggdrasil information Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk We can implement good documentation, even some good tools, but there will be a need for human help. I know there are a lot of iron in the fire, and a lot of thinking about the future, and we need to think of human specialize (the dreaded financial compensated) support. Look at Sun, HP, NeXT, Apple attempts to make adminstration "easier". I am not opening up the cesspool of debate on whether they are "easier", but everything details are hidden to make life "easy" it makes life more impossible when disaster strikes. Admin tools are great, shipped features are great, but niether are all incompassing to users needs. For example a Linux user was in my office yesterday because he could not save files in ftp and it turns out he moved his directory per instructions in a Linux how-to manual and left the files are directories owned by root. This shows that the Linux how-to was done wrong (should have tar cf - DIR | (cd NEWDIR; tar xf -) not copy, and also shows that there will be one more thing a person wants to do that is not in the tool or in the documentaion that a DOS person converted to Unix admin will need to do. I am non-core person, so I can ramble and suggest things outloud and not appear to reflect the FreeBSD insider's thoughts. Yes, we do need documentation, yes, we do need some tools that simplify things that are commonly done, AND we are starting to need people to hold the hands of people that have a particular setup need or driver. Should this be done commerically or within a FreeBSD oganization is a question of debate. --mark.