From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Fri May 30 15:06:57 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1465937B404 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:06:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phoenix.welearn.com.au (phoenix.welearn.com.au [139.130.44.81]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A38E43FE1 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:06:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sue@welearn.com.au) Received: from phoenix.welearn.com.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) h4UM6kgC089497; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:06:46 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from sue@phoenix.welearn.com.au) Received: (from sue@localhost) by phoenix.welearn.com.au (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4UM6jNK089496; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:06:45 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from sue) Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 08:06:45 +1000 From: Sue Blake To: Matthew Hunt Message-ID: <20030531080645.Q33085@welearn.com.au> Mail-Followup-To: Sue Blake , Matthew Hunt , chat@freebsd.org References: <3ECD3A8C.1040506@potentialtech.com> <00ae01c32668$2ff5ad70$2441d5cc@nitanjared> <20030531072026.O33085@welearn.com.au> <20030530213625.GA41089@wopr.caltech.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20030530213625.GA41089@wopr.caltech.edu>; from mph@astro.caltech.edu on Fri, May 30, 2003 at 02:36:25PM -0700 X-PGP-Fingerprint: E9A3 7B97 C563 DBB1 979E BC04 D2A2 9DA3 1274 7885 cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: grammar X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 22:06:57 -0000 On Fri, May 30, 2003 at 02:36:25PM -0700, Matthew Hunt wrote: > On Sat, May 31, 2003 at 07:20:26AM +1000, Sue Blake wrote: > > > Recently I provided some IT staff with the documentation for a > > new piece of software. Many times it said things like "In case > > Foo, do Bar". The users (correctly in my view) read that as > > advice of a precaution worth taking, and took it. > > Could this be a .us-vs-.au issue? Possibly. If so, I wonder which way the rest of the world goes. > Here in the US, at least, it is > common for fire alarms to have instructions like "In case of fire, pull > handle." We had signs like that here for a while, and they were strictly speaking correct for our language. The presence of "of" changes the meaning and makes it clear, at least to someone in a calm state who can stop and process language patterns that are not part of every day speech (i.e. only found on emergency signs). Comedians had a field day with people pulling handles, smashing glass windows, etc, just in case the disaster might happen. But I agree, that usage is correct by my language. The phrase "in case of" and the phrase "in case" have very different meanings. > And I interpreted your examples the way the author intended, > although I understand the ambiguity. Certainly mothers here will > tell their kids to carry sweaters "in case it cools off." Yes it's the same here. In Strine that would be: "Take your jumper with you in case it gets cold". The mother expects the kid to pick up the item right away and take it with them, despite the heat. She does not expect them to come home and pick it up later IF it gets cold. No, they take it anyway, IN CASE it gets cold. Tell me, how would you follow the following (hypothetical) instruction? In case you run out of memory, don't run all of the programs together. Is it something to do as a precaution, or a response to take when an unlikely situation occurs? I would read it as a precaution and make a workplace rule that we must follow it. Now if it said If you run out of memory, don't run all of the programs together. would the meaning be different? I believe so. If it is intended to mean the same thing, what would be the reason for avoiding the word "if"? -- Regards, -*Sue*-