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Date:      Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:44:59 +0100
From:      Matthew Whelan <muttley@gotadsl.co.uk>
To:        "Andrew P. Lentvorski" <bsder@mail.allcaps.org>, Doug Barton <DougB@FreeBSD.ORG>
Cc:        Helge Oldach <helge.oldach@atosorigin.com>, Jay Sachs <jay@eziba.com>, stanb@awod.com, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG, des@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: ssh to remote machines problem after cvsup
Message-ID:  <085ZD83DCOI01WSJ4ZGFURN87PJ.3d2cb8eb@VicNBob>
In-Reply-To: <20020709231825.L5990-100000@master.gorean.org>

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10/07/2002 07:23:43, Doug Barton <DougB@FreeBSD.ORG> wrote:

>the distinction that you are failing to make is that there are many
>different kinds of "changes" to the system. Changes that improve a driver,
>changes that update systems like sendmail, even when they require some
>small config changes, are candidates for -stable. Changes like this that
>have serious potential for causing major problems, AS HAS ALREADY BEEN
>DEMONSTRATED; are not.

Most people seem to feel that if you were adding ssh a-fresh now, you'd add 
it with 2,1 not 1,2. UPDATING clearly flags the change. You only get bitten 
if you remote upgrade without first understanding the significance of the 
changes from your current version of the O/S. Why do we even have an 
UPDATING if you're going to preclude making changes that bite people who are 
unaware of the details it lays out? And yes I understand people installing 
releases might not read UPDATING, but they really should be reading the 
release notes, which have also been updated.

The number of people asking for help on this issue on -stable has been 
relatively low, and some of them were in the window between the initial 
commit and the current version of the UPDATING text so were bitten by a lack 
of documentation that has since been rectified.

How much are you going to hold back developement on the chance that people 
doing stupid things get hurt? Are you going to remove fdisk because it has 
the potential to trash a hard disc?

Matthew



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