From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Oct 8 15:26:02 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60784E1A for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2013 15:26:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrnils@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qc0-x236.google.com (mail-qc0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 222DB2A7D for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2013 15:26:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qc0-f182.google.com with SMTP id n4so6180152qcx.27 for ; Tue, 08 Oct 2013 08:26:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=PUoMZHM8zcaNyKRsPHDKf0p8mVuMEV6b9h5bjEl9yeI=; b=AvpMc+2jDduQS7LJHEDgWMKZ+9aisrJT1lS6Tc9fd4Bsz9dS8foZNQh7crLACtKDoV U8Q7+ewT9arafmuD4T2OprX2/Rck/bhigvHu3IZ3b6umRX00X7/Yr9/n+T82Q0/GisXA YBolg+U/PQvG34aAMUYDTGa6FQsRBHtQSwnUzx8TrNRPCi6K68cuoB3hnOYUs5FhgYo0 gguTeeEvkXO+ZR9JGkecRfXf720vW0LEYSR24cPusX/gQMB/YJVL5txAmXK0rd0mth3G sMQAqTd/SKI/CJvAAsT9E7XQAqxcPjJ87iB6NMygnL2c5YcJcrLKeAKFgZr5sbfW21gY 2uYw== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.224.73.200 with SMTP id r8mr4621068qaj.72.1381245961343; Tue, 08 Oct 2013 08:26:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.49.29.234 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Oct 2013 08:26:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <525422B6.9040906@mu.org> References: <60177810-8DC4-4EA3-8040-A834B79039D2@orthanc.ca> <52538EDC.2080001@freebsd.org> <52541202.3010707@mu.org> <20131008.170444.74714516.sthaug@nethelp.no> <525422B6.9040906@mu.org> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2013 17:26:01 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: rcs From: Andreas Nilsson To: Alfred Perlstein Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.14 Cc: Current FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2013 15:26:02 -0000 On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 5:20 PM, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > On 10/8/13 8:04 AM, sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > >> I think the fact is that most direct users of RCS use it in a very >>>> simple way, and >>>> it works just fine for that. with no real need for any updates or any >>>> change. >>>> >>> With all due respect Julian, The more we discuss this more this really >>> points to the problem that FreeBSD appears to be a challenge to install >>> packages into such that a package moving out of base is such a big deal. >>> >>> Can we fix that instead? >>> >>> I mean, this change should really not be a big deal, but yet it is and >>> this speaks to the core of FreeBSD utility. >>> >> Not commenting on RCS here, but on the concept of moving packages out >> of the base: >> >> - For some of us, the attraction of FreeBSD is that it is a tightly >> integrated system, and the base contains enough useful functionality >> that we don't *have* to add a lot of packages. >> >> - Each package that is moved out of the base system means less useful >> functionality in the base system - and for me: Less reason to use >> FreeBSD instead of Linux. >> >> I absolutely see the problem of maintaining out-of-date packages in >> the base system, and the desirability of making the base system less >> reliant on GPL. I'm mostly troubled by the fact that there seems to >> be a rather strong tendency the last few years of having steadily >> less functionality in the base system - and I'm not at all convinced >> that the right balance has been found here. >> >> This discussion is not new, and I don't expect to convince any new >> persons... >> >> >> I'm sure other devs will disagree, but with ~15 years of FreeBSD > experience and ~13 years as a dev, my very strong opinion is that this > tightly coupled system is actually a boat anchor sinking us. > > Just because no one else does it a certain way, does not mean that a > unique way of doing something is correct and/or sustainable. Maybe in > 1995, 1999, or 2005 even, but not today. Especially in the context of > add-on tools like rcs. > > What we need to discuss is lowering the bar to making custom installs. > > I personally find that installing FreeBSD is useless until I install > "screen, zsh, vim-lite, git" why is that so manual for me? Why can't I > just register a package set somewhere so that all I have to type in is > "alfred.perlstein.devel" into a box during the installer and I get all my > packages by default? > > -- > Alfred Perlstein > > You technically can. Make your own "meta-port" which depends on the stuff you want. Build package-set with for example poudriere, ship those packages on your install-media. Done. /Andreas > > ______________________________**_________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/**mailman/listinfo/freebsd-**current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@** > freebsd.org " >