From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat May 23 08:02:12 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A8A22FB1DA for ; Sat, 23 May 2020 08:02:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [217.72.192.73]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49TbRl1x9Sz4WN5 for ; Sat, 23 May 2020 08:02:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.12.35.23]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue107 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MCsDe-1jlEnB36H2-008q6Z; Sat, 23 May 2020 10:02:01 +0200 Date: Sat, 23 May 2020 10:02:00 +0200 From: Polytropon To: Odhiambo Washington Cc: Doug Denault , User Questions Subject: Re: updating a FreeBSD workstation Message-Id: <20200523100200.04579e5d.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:SoAYQhLrZSdTwqpSkp53ODbIM5foxbeJEgLJu7/uTG2eRKyqwIM rcbdl6fR2OBlTO4OkY2hOMUr+XqG2HUP6mA32QVFuynEJCmN1Dppplw9UDisblWeUW75lqG WDRzUNzurDOMgyEGy6bqir6CErvHZIELnLPyBWUTBQP7iG3/fgujzSkfCzjA7ehEBsai319 rWYHp4hUjRqIsEN9H5P0A== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:+dTLtVWWxTk=:Q58OC0Hkocf/fLy+mqlHF8 5Yf2CLThLJpC2h0b62fYzkKWAUWIpNLcKo0cksQLLjxRfUcdtE2OQBjb0O4DQCL69Tg4BLbcp apEP7E9FOMH7RTdYBkf89uRrqXzkjKVeAzmrDMsU6coPArNZYIYveu/iLzPIS4szLRWK58Gxh g5nY4UWuailWwZf4Y9byVV4AwXtJZRXPDwQshP43Z/MARKpZ9rJAQ1032gYVXc1hun54I8GrK tOa+a/8PwZouBiUMqXX41q25Ji6StjsB6wTzqKBBUYch9I+IIqy6e0d+PQ6DPyDZRlk5O6Lj3 KlfPmNmXoGEvSpBtBZs5/ViyYkxsEyVaWxTGZcKXEZJGaAxNnLyUVvofE+ubRlnkTwW2RFXsr 6+PILV1ifUjyjRcF6VDxHD7KC5NKvZVDFWjICsZuOwe4L6t+I6Jd4Z93UVzTERQylPgzldJT5 ETJiiGS8cZuFWlMd3zdFHJxWEUNb0cEk12hl+bJIBuOFWeUVht1259iM2wWoQ22vLlGKT+FH7 hVBAlpG1G76UlQUO3gS5UWtlue0NYlFJDg0937m0siZUfRxmiJqdPG4LGWRxl4WGIfF1+xSwA /bcRFghLDoAW5OmGwHj3ffhsqpEG4/66HZvC2Gp6HNvkkztMF2w6dy5x4Dycm9ssfBkFQL4XC meJVL2RpKk4goQCOEOw6daeka9SGdCkIs5JEwQGR1Nq3YGSAOdmvTt7UmBddulscGQxcGO8W0 LCn+GzEJgKaPiK9E+5UYhcsUOnHaOiM+jJDxNmCgpXsfk7VUZVqP+VgGelpCRdsBcMDPGJzf7 oOhzXSWHlaFxkRrSasnpV+/Z6YktBhKIYpROjIAVzSOo5pRYM/pzkZdqNn5dt8eKqCHHQwq X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 49TbRl1x9Sz4WN5 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 217.72.192.73) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.01 / 15.00]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[178.12.35.23:received]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:217.72.192.0/20, country:DE]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.25)[0.247]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.64)[0.639]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.72)[0.722]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[217.72.192.73:from]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[217.72.192.73:from]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 May 2020 08:02:12 -0000 On Sat, 23 May 2020 10:47:37 +0300, Odhiambo Washington wrote: > Look at it this way: Ardent FreeBSD guys started PC-BSD, which was quite > good for the > Desktop. They then changed to TrueOS (just the name) and finally decided > that TrueOS > is better left to be their server version and https://project-trident.org/ to > be their Desktop > version. The later is based on something called Void Linux (I am hearing > about that for > the first time today after your post prompted me to look for PC-BSD, > TrueOS). > So either head to Project Trident or just identify some Linux for the > Desktop. You will have > and an easier life. Additionally, what about Lumina? FreeBSD was supposed to get a native desktop environment that better suited the needs for working with FreeBSD (as the OS) than desktops ported from Linux, which still don't really offer a consistent and useful interface to FreeBSD system functions and configuration. Of course, this would only cover the desktop - not any application program (like web browser, office suite, vector graphics program, photo manipulation or video editing tool), which are again coming from Linux, and therefore carry a lot of specific dependencies where the gap of "FreeBSD vs. Linux" seems to be increasing. I mentioned system functions: Lumina was supposed to offer GUI interfaces to system configuration, hardware management, networking, OS and application updates, diagnostics, and so on, things that most users would probably expect to be integrated in a desktop. So I'd say, if you want a "just works", use Linux. You'll find all things mentioned in an integrated form, working. Because it was made for Linux, it will work on Linux. That is not a statement that suggests that it's impossible to get an excellent desktop with FreeBSD (I know it - I'm using them for decades). There is even a port "mkdesktop" that does most of the work for you: You select which desktop you want, and the port will take care of the dependencies. The core problem is: "the desktop" means different things to different people. What does it include? Just a GUI file manager and icons on the wallpaper? Or bundled applications? And what about integration with the OS, so you can configure your system? The "problem" with choice: Whatever your definition is, you'll definitely find something that suits your needs. :-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...