From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Dec 17 18:22:27 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14DBF16A41F for ; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 18:22:27 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from billn@ywave.com) Received: from smtpout1.ywave.com (ycomradius.yelmtel.com [216.227.100.60]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4EB8F43D64 for ; Sat, 17 Dec 2005 18:22:26 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from billn@ywave.com) Received: (qmail 27942 invoked by uid 502); 17 Dec 2005 18:22:25 -0000 Received: from dsl13091.ywave.com (HELO ?10.0.0.25?) (billn@66.243.212.91) by 0 with SMTP; 17 Dec 2005 18:22:25 -0000 X-CLIENT-IP: 66.243.212.91 X-CLIENT-HOST: dsl13091.ywave.com Message-ID: <43A45789.7080601@ywave.com> Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 10:23:05 -0800 From: Bill Nicholls User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (OS/2; U; Warp 4.5; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050922 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org References: <20051217120101.BBEDB16A440@hub.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <20051217120101.BBEDB16A440@hub.freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Release Schedule for 2006 X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 18:22:27 -0000 Let me add my voice to this discussion. I have been a happy user of FreeBSD from 4.0 thru 4.11, but have stumbled repeatedly on 5.x and now 6.0. For some reason, I can get these (5 & 6) installed, but not stable or running KDE, yet 4.11 runs solid for months. In addition, not being able to run KDE from Generic has been an additional headache. This has become such a problem that I finally loaded Suse Linux 10 on my alternate disk so I can move ahead. I use dual 9G disks and alternate installs, stairstepping from one release to the next, with the ability to boot back to an older release. This has worked well until now. This is particularly bad timing because FreeBSD is my *preferred* OS for significant parts of my work, and it was planned to host an important DB project on another machine bought for that purpose. I was hoping that 6.0 would enable me to move ahead on my FreeBSD workstation, and then on my DB project. Instead I am stalled and forced to go to a less preferred solution. I don't know what, if anything, I am doing wrong. I gave away an expensive SOYO MB because FreeBSD would not install, later found out that the advanced SOYO ACPI was the problem, apparently solved later. Color me frustrated. For me the issue is very simple - I need to install release X.Y, install KDE, configure X and get to work. Becoming an internals expert or even small time developer is not what I need to do even though I have done that kind of work in the past. Now I concentrate on getting applications into production, with OS maintenence limited to chasing glitches. Color me very frustrated. I've been used to great stability on FreeBSD, less frequent changes than Linux, and fewer problems. The system just *worked*. No longer. I don't blame anybody on the team for this issue because from my POV, the attention on getting better SMP and generally upgrading the kernel quality was and is a good objective. However, along the way, a few less obvious characteristics have lost out. When it gets to the point that I am forced to use something else despite my efforts, then attention needs to be spent making FreeBSD work 'Out of the Box' again. Simple is good - you can always get complicated if that is your preference, but for a lot of us, FreeBSD is a tool, not a career. Again, this is not a flame but a plea to make the system simply work. BillN http://www.billswrite.com