From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Dec 7 23:03:31 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B123ACC2; Fri, 7 Dec 2012 23:03:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adrian.chadd@gmail.com) Received: from mail-we0-f182.google.com (mail-we0-f182.google.com [74.125.82.182]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDDE48FC0C; Fri, 7 Dec 2012 23:03:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-we0-f182.google.com with SMTP id u54so524696wey.13 for ; Fri, 07 Dec 2012 15:03:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=oKX30tmFUpX/N2jwBuxGyy4Lw+mmVzZ/L4AF+bvRv/I=; b=d6zRvOe9foldER2Vh4Oh6bfbYuTFD7UCbOvstHEEaKau4CZqpIHO2l24HVekH0HVR8 lTzy9MydorK/OMamEsFg+tB4rvYpKamC6WnjSq9njj3h3Jy/X8FgE/rQmVyif2QAFTR0 X7oylmYU/I80tXjkd84DHyNmA04EFpJKBuiN57iwnWtX+myAhf4tLnWpwonqzAb8s+JT itEdA+Sa7QxcxvLX/RKcLyWiHLmJFweD8X6xZYVsWx3+JlKGpTzDWsW/hoj9jduhdN4V jgx4PINZB089Fy9M54mQIWVnhlWa4syo7sxOBqEw7OqvjkQQPgnHyVMgXBECWn9Gt7AR zvXw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.180.88.71 with SMTP id be7mr871410wib.17.1354921403986; Fri, 07 Dec 2012 15:03:23 -0800 (PST) Sender: adrian.chadd@gmail.com Received: by 10.217.57.9 with HTTP; Fri, 7 Dec 2012 15:03:23 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <50C26BF9.1050106@mu.org> References: <201211270304.qAR34PfD056691@svn.freebsd.org> <50B53ABC.1010304@freebsd.org> <50B57F46.1060207@mu.org> <50C205DC.1040701@freebsd.org> <50C23B5E.3020509@freebsd.org> <50C26BF9.1050106@mu.org> Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2012 15:03:23 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: CxMjfG0ovpuiIxrNIk-UGoCjUpA Message-ID: Subject: Re: svn commit: r243594 - head/sys/netinet From: Adrian Chadd To: Alfred Perlstein Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: Alfred Perlstein , Andre Oppermann , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 07 Dec 2012 23:03:31 -0000 Alfred, I can make the same argument about "out of the box" experiences with Linux and FreeBSD on embedded. If the embedded experience out of the box "isn't as good or better" than Linux, people will go with Linux. I think you're only really considering the server space. The bigger issue here is "people who are changing the algorithms are making different but same mistakes as the earlier algorithms", which is "works for me,". Solving a lot of this stuff for both small and large scale doesn't _have_ to be too difficult. The current attempt at making things nicer for the server space has shown it doesn't work for the non-server space. That means the problem isn't fully understood. Honestly, I'd rather see a lot of this auto-tuning be done at run-time rather than compile or boot time, with some relatively smart tools that can look at the system specifications and current mbuf/allocator configuration, look at some historical information about allocations, and make suggestions about what can be tuned. You can _also_ make the defaults work well on the low end and the high end. The tool(s) shouldn't be _instead_ of that, it should be _with_ that. Let's try to understand the problem space a bit better before we start changing things some more. It's obvious from the recent changes that people don't understand the bigger picture. Adrian