Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:11:18 +0100 From: Martin Hudec <corwin@aeternal.net> To: freebsd-newbies@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD-newbies group is a compromise community. Message-ID: <200403190811.28651.corwin@aeternal.net> In-Reply-To: <20040318222230.F54150@floyd.gnulife.org> References: <1079648282.405a201a64217@savaka.com> <20040319030343.GA21807@wantadilla.lemis.com> <20040318222230.F54150@floyd.gnulife.org>
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=2D----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Good morning, Jamie, that is absolutely wrong to say that you didn't want to bother the=20 gurus and wizs. Everyone of those people, which you prefer to call gurus an= d=20 wizs, one time in a galaxy far far away were newbies like you, they stumble= d=20 upon the same problems like you do nowadays as newbie. I would not prefer t= o=20 use such terms to highlight someone's knowledge. My experience from general= =20 linux mailing lists is that members usually do sort themselves in some kind= =20 of classes (user, power user, guru - use any terms you like). And this caus= e=20 that someone who is calling himself a newbie might get ignored by someone w= ho=20 is calling himself as guru, just for this simple reason that he is guru and= =20 that is too demeaning for him to answer this (from his point of view) simpl= e=20 and easy question. The -question mailing list is just for asking tech suppo= rt=20 questions no matter how simple or how complicated they seem to be. On=20 =2D -questions there are many people willing to help. And it looks like tha= t=20 =46reeBSD users are more grown up than linux users (my subjective opinion -= =20 many of the linux so called gurus are still living in the opinion that they= =20 are the best, they know everything because they don't use that redmond=20 operating system, so they see themselves as some kind of ueber-men..), so=20 they will answer, or at least try to shown the direction how to solve this = or=20 that. If you ask for tech support here on -newbies list of course you might= =20 get the right answer, but risk of getting less accurate answer here is more= =20 higher than in -questions list. You are saying that plenty of folks on -questions are getting flamed.. well= I=20 have not seen this for quite time now (maybe I am not paying lot of attenti= on=20 to list), but it is always nice to see that person asking for help did at=20 least some research on his own (reading log files, trying google.. "in goog= le=20 non est, ergo non est"). Sometimes I see questions like "my proftpd server= =20 stopped to work, please help" and those are the questions when I feel like = I=20 need a crystall ball to find out what happened to the proftpd. Please don't= =20 get me wrong. I always try to help, no matter how stupid or easy question=20 seems to be. I was new to world of FreeBSD once too (and I am still - maybe= I=20 am good in ipfw traffic shaping, maybe I lack any experience at all in bind= 9=20 matters etc.), and I needed (and sometimes I need) the same kind of help yo= u=20 asking for now. What I hate is the guru-like approach like "rtfm! man=20 make.conf". That is too childish. Remember that the most stupid questions a= re=20 those which we are never about to ask. Enjoy and explore that nice world of= =20 =46reeBSD and its possibilities. cheers, Martin On Fri March 19 2004 05:43, Jamie wrote: > Sorry, I should have read the charter. I didn't want to bother the > gurus and wizards with what I thought might be a question which would come > from someone inexperienced, and title "newbies" *sounded* like a good > place to ask it. I was just judging it by the name of the group, and not > by the charter, so thats how I made my mistake. To me, newbies sounds like > a haven for those whose asbestos underwear are away at the laundromat. Had > I read the charter, I wouldn't have posted in newbies. > > I see plenty of folks in freebsd-questions getting flamed for not reading > the manual, when I think in fact many of them are so inexperienced > that they aren't aware of just where the manual they need is yet, or > whether the additional manual they need even exists. A lot of questions > are probably even ignored because people read the questions and think to > themselves "I won't answer this - the guy hasn't read the manual, or he > doesn't have a clue what is going on". Sometimes the person with the > question may have read the manual but misunderstood it, or could not > locate the relevant docs. > =2D --=20 : :. kind regards :.. Martin Hudec :.: :.: =3Dw=3D http://www.aeternal.net :.: =3Dm=3D +421.907.303393 :.: =3D@=3D corwin@aeternal.net :.: :.: "When you want something, all the universe=20 :.: conspires in helping you to achieve it." :.: - The Alchemist (Paulo Coelho) =2D----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFAWp0gZYEZIv+rgggRAp6pAJ9ZhEyWSgFIVXkSztIF5+gW3AS2ywCggP2b 5+vF5SlCV0EUVOzbgu03U5k=3D =3D0gKn =2D----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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