Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 09:30:34 -0700 From: "Ted Mittelstaedt" <tedm@toybox.placo.com> To: "Rahul Siddharthan" <rsidd@physics.iisc.ernet.in>, "Greg Lehey" <grog@lemis.com> Cc: "Brian Raynes" <brian_raynes@dnr.state.ak.us>, <freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG> Subject: RE: [dn-core] Re: Perens' "Free Software Leaders Stand Together" Message-ID: <000001c0e213$5c706660$1401a8c0@tedm.placo.com> In-Reply-To: <20010521114737.C96248@lpt.ens.fr>
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Ted Mittelstaedt tedm@toybox.placo.com Author of: The FreeBSD Corporate Networker's Guide Book website: http://www.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG >[mailto:owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Rahul >Siddharthan >Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 2:48 AM >To: Greg Lehey >Cc: Ted Mittelstaedt; Brian Raynes; freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG >Subject: Re: [dn-core] Re: Perens' "Free Software Leaders Stand >Together" > > >Greg Lehey said on May 21, 2001 at 17:23:45: >> >> Let me give a counterexample. This polarization is not to our >> >> advantage. It's not to the GPL community's advantage either. >> > >> > Um, well if that is the case then why didn't Bruce include us? >> >> You still don't know? I think I've told you three times. >> >> Do me a favour, will you? Point us to a photo of you so we can be >> sure you're not Brett Glass in disguise. > > >He isn't: Brett's linebreaks occur at the proper places :) > >Ted's view is not at all uncommon in the BSD world, it seems to me >Greg is the exceptional one -- eg see Wes Peters' posting on daily >daemonnews, >http://daily.daemonnews.org/view_story.php3?story_id=1918 > >My take on this is: the "free software community" (aka open source >community, aka linux community because most linux developers do have >that mindset) wants to change the world. The BSD community wants to >write good software but is not interested in changing the world. So >there's a fundamental difference. > I think you are on to something, but I also think that the BSD world is _less_ cohesive than the Linux community. It's like that communities view is that if you go Linux you accept everything they are doing. The BSD people are more easy-going I think. >This is the context of my earlier remarks on "activism" on issues like >DeCSS -- such activism simply does not exist in the BSD world. Ted's >entire response to my mail was to justify in detail why there's no >point in doing anything. For me it's that issue only - it's more of a "choose your battles" thing, and I've not chosen DeCSS, I've chosen other things. (like the Microsoft business) But, I'd say that while it's overstating to say there's _no_ activism, I think your probably close to the mark that there is a lot less than among the GPL. >The only worry BSD people ever have is, why >aren't people using their system when it's better than linux? Well, >it's better, but linux has a different worldview and many people are >attracted by that. > >Another example: Dan Bernstein, the man who (apart from writing qmail, >djbdns, etc) sued the US government for the right to post crypto code >on the net for educational purposes. His favourite operating system >is OpenBSD; he's not known to be a big linux fan. But many in the >linux world would consider him part of the "linux community" (which is >generally a misnomer for the free software community), because of the >things he's done and the software he's written. I don' t think anyone >considers him part of the BSD community, least of all the BSD >community itself. > >I don't have a problem with any of this. If the BSD people >want to focus on improving their code, well, that indicates focus and >commitment, and those are good things. > >BUT -- if the same BSD people then turn around and complain that Bruce >Perens isn't asking them to sign his petition -- *that* I have a >problem with. That's hypocrisy. That's wanting things both ways. > No, that's not because I don't subscribe to the _world BSD view_ if such a thing exists. It might be hypocrisy for someone like _Greg_ to demand a place on Bruce's petition, because Greg seems opposed to that kind of activism, so that would be consistent for him. But, it's not hypocrisy for _me_ to be demanding it because I've been more activist. >I'm thinking of expanding these views into a longer article, but >thought I'd see how people react... > Just keep in mind that the BSD people like being tarred by the same brush even less than the Linux people do. Be careful and you should do fine. >Rahul > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message
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