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Date:      Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:31:17 +1000
From:      Da Rock <rock_on_the_web@comcen.com.au>
To:        freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: Why FreeBSD not popular on hardware vendors
Message-ID:  <1229229078.18610.80.camel@laptop2.herveybayaustralia.com.au>
In-Reply-To: <20081212212931.F5072@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl>
References:  <1228733482.4495.14.camel@laptop1.herveybayaustralia.com.au> <20081211103742.21621a6d@gom.home> <20081211190951.GB845@comcast.net> <20081211113257.405a082c@gom.home> <20081211202023.GC845@comcast.net> <20081211134622.15c81ecd@gom.home> <20081212002813.GD32300@kokopelli.hydra> <20081211170011.777236f8@gom.home> <20081212015814.GB32982@kokopelli.hydra> <20081212120437.B3687@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl> <20081212181258.GE36348@kokopelli.hydra> <ghuau9$juk$1@ger.gmane.org> <20081212203202.H4803@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl> <20081212150228.520ad7f8@scorpio> <20081212212931.F5072@wojtek.tensor.gdynia.pl>

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On Fri, 2008-12-12 at 21:35 +0100, Wojciech Puchar wrote:
> >> NVidia MUST INCLUDE full documentation of their hardware.
> >> this is normal - hardware manufacturer produces hardware, programmers
> >> do make support for it.
> >>
> >> what is common today isn't normal.
> >
> > I honestly have no idea what you are trying to communicate here.
> 
> exactly what i wrote. the problem is that people like You (and millions
> others) are willing to buy product without any documentation.
> 
> if you think they do this to hide their hardware secrets you are wrong.
> See x86 instruction set - does it reveal how Intel or Amd made their 
> processor so fast? no!
> 
> They do this to hide their hardware faults that way - that's the true 
> reason they do this.
> 
> With new hardware produced every year it MUST be buggy and certainly there 
> are thousands of hardware bugs.
> 
> with "secret" drivers - they can easily hide them. AFAIK at least half of 
> their driver code are to do workaround of their hardware bugs.

Actually that sounds like a very close approximation of what is going
on. It explains why cpu usage can go up some times during use.

What I can't equate with is why its acceptable for intel to do the
same... check if_iwi and its "firmware". No other wifi device (that I'm
aware of- at least they'd be in the minority anyway) works this way. The
excuse is fcc regs- I doubt that...

And before anyone defends intel: I've spent a lot of time wasted on
making their stupid nics to work in windows, I usually just flick em and
put in a rl nic. The cpus are shit as well- I've had no end of trouble
with them, plus too hot, power hungry etc. Alas, finding a decent
notebook with an alternative has been to no avail...




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