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Date:      Fri, 6 Jun 2014 17:17:40 +0200
From:      Baptiste Daroussin <bapt@FreeBSD.org>
To:        Paul Schmehl <pschmehl_lists@tx.rr.com>
Cc:        Michael Gmelin <grembo@freebsd.org>, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, Alfred Perlstein <alfred@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: Who was the mental genius
Message-ID:  <20140606151739.GC73493@ivaldir.etoilebsd.net>
In-Reply-To: <18E02559D230ED6DF11C040A@localhost>
References:  <D2EE1900E54F5DC324E503D3@localhost> <5390E62E.6090807@madpilot.net> <6CEF0183772C97582B196466@Pauls-MacBook-Pro.local> <539130B3.9030604@freebsd.org> <8CA324878D330942AB8AE0B3@Pauls-MacBook-Pro.local> <5391611A.3090406@marino.st> <53917957.2020909@freebsd.org> <53917A30.8050504@marino.st> <EA88DBD9-F436-4107-9181-45A5375C6442@freebsd.org> <18E02559D230ED6DF11C040A@localhost>

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On Fri, Jun 06, 2014 at 09:34:26AM -0500, Paul Schmehl wrote:
> --On June 6, 2014 at 10:51:04 AM +0200 Michael Gmelin <grembo@freebsd.org=
>=20
> wrote:
>=20
> >
> >
> >> On 06 Jun 2014, at 10:22, John Marino <freebsd.contact@marino.st> wrot=
e:
> >>
> >>> On 6/6/2014 10:18, Alfred Perlstein wrote:
> >>> Sure, but really a couple of lines to warn people and wave them towar=
ds
> >>> next steps is probably advisable next time.
> >>
> >> Maybe we can alter the "uname -a" string to show the EOL so that every
> >> time the machine boots you see it on top of the MOTD.
> >>
> >> :)
> >>
> >> Of course, that won't help for the turn-on-and-forget servers with
> >> uptime measured in years...
> >>
> >> As a serious questions, where should such a "you have X months/days
> >> remaining before server is EOL, update before then" messages pop up?
> >> weekly cron messages sent to root?
> >
> > periodic/security/450-check_eol ?(info if < 90 days left, error if past
> > eol)
> >
>=20
> EOL notification is not the problem.  The problem is breaking ports at EO=
L.=20
> That's a special circumstance and begs for notification.  This isn't rock=
et=20
> science.
>=20
> For at least two months now this notification has been popping up every=
=20
> time I work on ports.
>=20
> /!\ WARNING /!\
> pkg_install EOL is scheduled for 2014-09-01. Please consider migrating to=
=20
> pkgng
> http://blogs.freebsdish.org/portmgr/2014/02/03/time-to-bid-farewell-to-th=
e-old-pkg_-tools/
> If you do not want to see this message again set=20
> NO_WARNING_PKG_INSTALL_EOL=3Dyes in your make.conf
>=20
> Do you think I would miss the 9/1 deadline?  Not a chance.  But the advan=
ce=20
> warning gives me time to plan the change when it's convenient for me.
>=20
> This change has me scrambling to adapt.  Granted, it only took me a few=
=20
> minutes to figure out what to do, but not everyone has the background and=
=20
> experience to do that.  Some will simply panic.  Others will switch to=20
> Linux.
>=20
> That doesn't seem like a goal FreeBSD should support.

The mental genius is me apparently (thanks for the kind words, btw) I'm
responsible for both the pkg_install EOL message and for breaking ports tree
with older make (btw you can recover with installing manually bmake).

Yes it would have been a good idea to give a warning to the user about the =
fact
that the ports tree won't be support long on after EOL of 8.3, given the po=
rts
tree will break again quite soon after EOL of 8.4 I should think about addi=
ng
such a message right now (btw this is not that easy in the case we are talk=
ing
about because I have no way to differentiate a fmake with support for :tl f=
rom a
fmake without support for :tu same goes for :tu) hence it is hard to print a
message.

Concerning breaking after 8.4 EOL it might be easier.

The reason why I haven't added a warning like I did for pkg_install is that:
1. it is hard to detect when to print the warning (more complicated that on=
e can
imagine first)
2. freebsd-update is already issueing a warning about EOL coming soon so I =
would
have expected user to already know when EOL is coming and/or getting the in=
fo
=66rom freebsd-update.

regards,
Bapt


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