Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 07:58:52 -0700 From: Nate Williams <nate@mt.sri.com> To: Mike Smith <mike@smith.net.au> Cc: Nate Williams <nate@mt.sri.com>, Luoqi Chen <luoqi@watermarkgroup.com>, committers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Stuff in /sbin and /usr/sbin (was Re: full path of sysctl in bsd.port.mk? ) Message-ID: <199812021458.HAA05458@mt.sri.com> In-Reply-To: <199812020834.AAA05369@dingo.cdrom.com> References: <199812020524.WAA03866@mt.sri.com> <199812020834.AAA05369@dingo.cdrom.com>
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> > > >From hier(7):
> > >
> > > /sbin/ system programs and administration utilities fundamental to both
> > > single-user and multi-user environments
> > >
> > > sysctl is a system program fundamental to both single-user and
> > > multi-user environments. It's a popular misconception that */sbin
> > > contains administrator-only programs; one that is popular amongst the
> > > sort of admins that like to keep their users as much in the dark as
> > > possible.
> >
> > Actually, go look at the programs in /sbin, and you'll be hard pressed
> > to find any 'generically' useful programs aside from ping and traceroute
> > that normal users can use.
>
> Sure, because most of them aren't required in single-user mode and thus
> are in /usr/sbin. If you take this criteria out, ie. just look at all
> of the programs in */sbin, you'll find a pile more. The ones in /sbin
> simply have the extra requirement that they be available in single-user
> mode.
Before I fired off the original email I reviewed the stuff in both /sbin
and /usr/sbin, and like I said aside from ping and traceroute there
isn't much useful for normal users.
> > I'd say this 'misconception' is anything but a misconception, but a fact
> > of the way life is.
>
> Not at all. The division between 'bin' and 'sbin' material is
> conceptually reasonably clear, and it's not drawn along admin/non-admin
> lines.
Sure it is. Look at the definition above.
/sbin/ system programs and administration utilities fundamental to both
^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Sounds like system configuration and administration to me, which normal
users shouldn't be using.
[ sysctl ]
> > Agreed, but it's not generically useful, nor should it be something
> > normal users should rely on using. The interface changes too much, and
> > it's use should be 'hidden' from use by normal users so they don't
> > *have* to use it to get their job done.
>
> It is generally useful; witness the context of the discussion.
No, it's not. Just because we've hammered it into submission doesn't
make it any more generically useful. Sysctl is a FreeBSD-only utility,
and as such can not be counted on to do anything useful in anything but
FreeBSD. As such, users should not be expected to know what it does,
nor to know the special magic MIB's that are useful for generic things
and which are system things, and which are administrative things, etc...
Nate
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