Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:18:33 -0600 From: "Allan Ross" <allanr@ssimicro.com> To: <freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG> Cc: "Gary Kline" <kline@tera.com>, "Dutch Collins" <dutch@charm.net>, "Mitch Collinsworth" <mkc@Graphics.Cornell.EDU>, "Thomas Good" <tomg@nrnet.org>, "Doug" <Doug@gorean.org> Subject: RE: Question about the mascot Message-ID: <002801bee42e$4d5b2500$0201a8c0@allan.alerius.net> In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.96.990811125811.28992A-100000@mailhost.nrnet.org>
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I have been following this thread rather closely, out of a morbid sense
of curiosity more than anything. I wasn't planning on commenting, but
the more I thought about the issue, the more it bothered me. In a
nutshell, one camp has asked for advertising material without the demon
and then gone on to argue that the whole use of the demon as a mascot
should be stopped. The other side has argued that "Freedom of Speech"
is being restricted in such an argument and then goes on to staunchly
defend the use of the demon and suggest that their opponents find
another OS.
Pretty extreme, but then, emotional arguments usually are. Has it not
occurred to anyone, as Thomas Good suggested, that the OS could be used
without the demon mascot? That marketing might be the responsibility
of the marketer? I understand the argument against the mascot, whether
I agree with it or not. Would this request also include changing the
name of DaemonNews and any other mention of the offending word? Those
against the mascot are quick to point out that it is not THEY that
are necessarily offended but their potential customer. I would be
interested in hearing how they got past the mascot and the negative
aspects of a "demon" to understand and appreciate BSD. Could this not
be used as a strategy to market to other potentially offended users?
And to those that would suggest they find another OS: why? Simply use
the OS and ignore the mascot. It's not like it is a necessary component
to the operation of the OS. Seems to me a mascot is simply that: a
symbol.
And to address the extremism: Think about where extremes lead. This
is, after all, an argument in semantics. And words are the most
harmless AND the most dangerous tool I know. Who decided that a
demon (Judeo-Christian or otherwise) has red skin, horns, a tail, and
a pitchfork? Makes me want to laugh and cry all at once. A mere
coincidence of spelling occurs and a messenger of the Greek gods and
a servant of the Christian incarnation of evil have the same name. I
feel supremely sorry for anyone ever name "Elvis", "Adolph" or "Jesus"
for the persecution and abuse they must have to listen to from an
uneducated public.
It's enough to make me want to stop being left(sinister)-handed!
Allan Ross
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG
> [mailto:owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Thomas Good
> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 11:08 AM
> To: Doug
> Cc: Gary Kline; Dutch Collins; Mitch Collinsworth;
> freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG
> Subject: Re: Question about the mascot
>
>
> On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Doug wrote:
>
> > Thomas Good wrote:
> > >
> > > > If it makes you feel better you can go ahead and
> belittle people
> > > > who are put off by it. Knock yourself out. But the fact is, the
> > > > demon/daemon mascot puts some people off. From a marketing
> standpoint a
> > > > logo that makes X% of your target market uncomfortable (where X is
> > > > actually, most everyone who doesn't already know what *bsd
> is) is bad for
> > > > business. It doestn't matter WHY it's bad for business, or
> how morally
> > > > superior you feel because you are above those
> considerations, it IS bad
> > > > for business.
> > >
> > > If you don't make *some* people uncomfortable you *are* doing
> something
> > > wrong.
>
> > You are proving my point here. You don't care about the marketing
> > implications at all, it just makes you feel good to know that you are
>
> Argumentum ad hominem, Doug.
>
> My point is that if a product/idea requires a paradigm shift you make
> some people uncomfortable. Also, you seem less informed about marketing
> than you may wish to believe. Controversy sells. Try to ban
> something and watch sales trends. Have a look the last US gun control
> bill (assault weapons) and look at the net effect. Gun dealers *love*
> this bill...
>
> This issue to me is one of free speech, not marketing...BSD will continue
> to gain market share.
>
> > > Personally, I find people who want to restrict others'
> freedom of expression
> > > far more evil than people who draw cartoon daemons.
> >
> > No one is talking about restricting anyone's freedom of
> expression, least
> > of all me. All I am saying is that some promotional materials without
> > demons on them would be a good thing.
>
> So make some. I'll take a few and plaster them on my boxes. But you
> don't have the right to tell someone else that they shouldn't market their
> product as they see fit, based on your view of morality.
>
> Paradigm shift, guy...give it a shot.
>
> ------- North Richmond Community Mental Health Center -------
>
> Thomas Good MIS Coordinator
> Vital Signs: tomg@ { admin | q8 } .nrnet.org
> Phone: 718-354-5528
> Fax: 718-354-5056
>
> /* Member: Computer Professionals For Social Responsibility */
>
>
>
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