Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:14:09 -0700 From: Warner Losh <imp@harmony.village.org> To: Kris Kennaway <kris@FreeBSD.ORG> Cc: John Baldwin <jhb@FreeBSD.ORG>, "Donald J . Maddox" <dmaddox@sc.rr.com>, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, The Hermit Hacker <scrappy@hub.org>, Peter Wemm <peter@netplex.com.au> Subject: Re: lastest kernel from cvs ( sh exists with signal 8 ) Message-ID: <200101222014.f0MKE9911943@harmony.village.org> In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:36:41 PST." <20010122113641.A92053@citusc17.usc.edu> References: <20010122113641.A92053@citusc17.usc.edu> <20010122015502.A18847@cae88-102-101.sc.rr.com> <XFMail.010121231244.jhb@FreeBSD.org>
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In message <20010122113641.A92053@citusc17.usc.edu> Kris Kennaway writes: : I agree that developers don't need to use buildkernel because we are : mostly capable of doing the manual workarounds on the rare occasions : when things need to be done differently. But if you cast your mind : back to the many dozens of support messages on -stable and other lists : after the binutils upgrade, you will note that users are incapable of : following special-case directions even when their mailbox is full of : messages repeating them, and they need to have a magic wand which does : it for them. That's what buildkernel is supposed to be..whether or not : it's broken or can be fixed is a separate question. : : I never use buildkernel either because I know enough to fix things : when they break, but that's not true for Joe Random, and we shouldn't : advocate against it to the general user base unless we have a better : magic solution. Agreed. It *IS* the documented way of building kernels. It is in the handbook and we've been recommending it for over a year. If it is broken in some way, we should fix the way in which it is broken. Kris is right, most normal users can't follow directions more complex than make buildkernel. I've spent my time in the trenches, as have others which is why make buildkernel exists. Believe us when we tell you this. We had litterally a dozen questions each week about this before buildkernel. Now we have almost none (maybe 2-3 a month for people not using buildkernel, or whacked out cases where buildkernel was done without a buildworld immediately before it). If you don't like it, don't use it. If it is broken, fix it, or tell others how to fix it. Personally, I use it here from time to time to test things, but when I'm in a development cycle, I'm more likely to use the old way because I know enough to know what body part I'm about to shoot off... It is in the handbook, and has been for some time. I'm reviewing the recent KERNEL -> KERNCONF changes to make sure that they make it into the handbook properly (I assume there will be a MFC in a few days, since putting KERNEL in /etc/make.conf is a setup for disaster right now). Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
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