Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 18:40:05 -0400 From: Laurence Berland <stuyman@confusion.net> To: Brett Glass <brett@lariat.org> Cc: Wes Peters <wes@softweyr.com>, Frank Pawlak <fpawlak@execpc.com>, "Jordan K. Hubbard" <jkh@zippy.osd.bsdi.com>, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: You've lost it (was Re:No port of Opera? (Was: ((FreeBSD : Linux) :: (OS/2:Windows)))) Message-ID: <3967ADC5.1DDE73DA@confusion.net> References: <54397.962948030@localhost> <Your message of "Thu, 06 Jul 2000 23:08:47 MDT." <4.3.2.7.2.20000706225433.0475b4d0@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20000707004910.046d9ab0@localhost> <4.3.2.7.2.20000707211520.00d4a5d0@localhost>
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I've stayed out of this, but read the posts for a long time, but now
you've said something that undermines your own position.
Brett Glass wrote:
> Yes it does. "Defectors" who buy binaries targeted for another platform and
> run them under emulation will appear on the marketing radar screen as
> users of that other platform, making their own platform seem to have a
> smaller user base by comparison.
So we must not let this happen to FreeBSD, we must have native
support!!! How do we get this? We implement the FreeBSD api on Linux,
so that people will write to FreeBSD instead. Great! But, let's think
for a second. If it's bad to use emulators, if it hurts your platform
of choice, then why on earth do you think that a Linux user would be
fooled into using FreeBSD emulation?
> And by eliminating themselves from the
> set of potential customers for a native port, they reduce the incentive
> to create one. They're undermining their own platform.
>
Which of course we know every Linux user wants to do. The cry of Linux
has always been "down with MS, up with FSF, and undermine
Linux!!!"...Oh, wait, they *don't* want to undermine themselves.
> Use of an emulator should be reserved for emergencies only.
>
> --Brett
Let's ignore for a second that you've told us to eliminate the
linuxulator, leaving us high and dry when that emergency arrives or
before your prophetic native ports pour forth from the sky, and continue
my line of thinking...
Unless of course you're a Linux user, then you should use a FreeBSD
"emulator" because Brett Glass, who has FreeBSD in mind and *wants* to
decrease the Linux market share, tells you to. Are you even listening
yourself? You've managed to contradict yourself so many times that you
no longer hold ANY position.
And before you go to undermine my credibility, I'll beat you to the
punch. I just got out of HS, I'll go to college in the fall, and you
know a lot more about FreeBSD, CS, and the business than I do. That
said, I still know some logic. I'm curious how you'll talk your way out
of this one.
I've been reading many FreeBSD lists, and it would seem that if you want
a piece of code the way to get it is to find other who want it and then
write it. Arguing with people who don't need or want your code is
pointless. If you believe in this cause, go write your FreeBSD
emulator. Otherwise stop filling my mailbox with nonsense.
PHK wrote, in an email a bit back:
"I un-subscribed from -hackers several years ago, because I could
not keep up with the email load. Since then I have dropped off
several other lists as well for the very same reason.
And I still get a lot of email. A lot of it gets routed to /dev/null
by filters: People like Brett Glass will never make it onto my
screen, commits to documents in languages I don't understand
likewise, commits to ports as such. All these things and more go
the winter way without me ever even knowing about it."
When I read these words I couldn't quite understand what would make
*everything* from a single person be the equivalent of commit logs on
subjects that don't interest a person. Having read this thread, I think
I understand why Brett qualifies for this treatment.
Hoping that this is worth a little more than 2 cents,
--
Laurence Berland
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Windows 98: n.
useless extension to a minor patch release for
32-bit extensions and a graphical shell for a
16-bit patch to an 8-bit operating system
originally coded for a 4-bit microprocessor,
written by a 2-bit company that can't stand for
1 bit of competition.....But I'd still like wine around.
http://stuy.debate.net
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