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Date:      Tue, 1 Apr 2008 17:36:40 -0700
From:      "Martin Fouts" <mfouts@danger.com>
To:        "Matthew Dillon" <dillon@apollo.backplane.com>
Cc:        Christopher Arnold <chris@arnold.se>, arch@freebsd.org, qpadla@gmail.com, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org
Subject:   RE: Flash disks and FFS layout heuristics
Message-ID:  <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D22@EXCHANGE.danger.com>
In-Reply-To: <200804012325.m31NPwM1042551@apollo.backplane.com>
References:  <20080330231544.A96475@localhost> <200803310135.m2V1ZpiN018354@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D03@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200803312125.29325.qpadla@gmail.com> <200803311915.m2VJFSoR027593@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D09@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200803312006.m2VK6Aom028133@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D0A@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200803312254.m2VMsPqZ029549@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D0D@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200804011733.m31HXF6e039649@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D17@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200804012014.m31KEvTJ041049@apollo.backplane.com> <B95CEC1093787C4DB3655EF330984818051D1E@EXCHANGE.danger.com> <200804012325.m31NPwM1042551@apollo.backplane.com>

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=20

> I can't believe it, you actually think you know more=20
> about embedded design then I do!  What a laugh.
>=20
> I don't know a thing about you, and you clearly don't=20
> know a thing about me.  Here's a hint:  When you don't
> know you shouldn't assume.

So what part of "you think you know" is *not* an assumption?

> You think these problems are complex?

Yes. I do it. That's what makes them fun.

> Embedded systems these days are nearly complete
> single-chip microcomputers running hacked up but nearly complete
> operating systems containing 95% off-the-shelf software,=20
> much of it open source, and much of it provided to the developer on=20
> a shiny platter, with a fully operational SDK and HDK and FPGA logic=20
> around the core cpu.

It amazes me that you can assert to be so knowledgeable about embedded
systems and then make such a glaringly wrong description of the ones I
work on. Our current shipping product has *no* off-the-shelf software,
beyond a few small libraries for image encoding, out of several million
lines of code.  There's no 'fully operational SDK', beyond a gcc
crosscompiler that we've debugged ourselves. The SOC has no FPGA.

> All in one chip.  These days 'embedded' means you are sporting a
> completely functional linux operating system in a two=20
> chip solution

It's not a single chip or even two chips. It doesn't run linux.  Keep
guessing wrong, Matt.

> with virtually no external parts required beyond those=20
> needed for the connectors.

There are a lot more parts than connectors in the BOM.  Wrong again.

> And it's all now written in C or C++ or=20
> whatever the hell language you want to write it in.

Well, "whatever the hell language" gets you off on a technicality there,
Matt.

> It's crazy easy to do embedded development work these=20
> days.  No more difficult then writing software on a full blown PC.

There is a class of such development. Pity it's not the class I'm
working in.

>     I'm sorry, but if that is your idea of complex then its roughly
>     equivalent to my idea of ridiculously easy.

No, Matt, it's not my idea of complex.

I see that you're more in need of your advice about not assuming than I
am.




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