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Date:      Thu, 11 Nov 1999 15:14:04 -0800 (PST)
From:      Mike Meyer <mwm@phone.net>
To:        stable@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: ldconfig finding libraries, but ld is not.
Message-ID:  <14379.19900.963634.387520@guru.phone.net>
In-Reply-To: <19991111144938.B69565@pinky.plambert.net>
References:  <14378.28246.28493.440833@guru.phone.net> <199911112213.RAA34417@server.baldwin.cx> <14379.17630.340446.163663@guru.phone.net> <19991111144938.B69565@pinky.plambert.net>

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Paul M . Lambert writes:
;->> The bottom line is that taking the name people have standardized on
;->> for installing *local* packages and installing system-provided
;->> packages there is a bad thing(TM). None of the solutions I used
;->> suffered from that flaw.
;->Ports are not provided by the OS.  Neither are packages.

You're arguing semantics. Ports (and packages) come on the CD-ROM that
comes with my subscription to FreeBSD. I see complaints about ports
failing to build or function properly regularly on a mail list
@freebsd.org, and nobody complains that it's inappropriate. I won't
argue that they are part of the OS - if you won't argue that they
aren't part of the FreeBSD distribution (in fact, a major part as far
as I'm concerned.)

;->If there's a problem with a port, it's not the responsibility of
;->the people with commit access to the OS source.  It's a _port_.

It's the responsibility of the people who have commit access to the
*ports* tree. That's why problem reports about ports go to
freebsd-ports!

;->It belongs in /usr/local.

I don't agree. Things being maintainted and supported locally belong
in /usr/local. Ports and packages come on the distribution, and you go
back to the same channels for support as you do for core parts of that
distribution.

;->Items distributed with the OS and maintained by the maintainers of
;->the OS belong in /usr; items specific to each machine (which may
;->not be on the next FreeBSD machine you encounter) belong in
;->/usr/local.  Code I've written myself, I put in /usr/local.

I'm sorry, but if you believe that optional parts of the distribution
belong in /usr/local, the sendmail clearly belongs there:

	bash-2.03$ grep -i sendmail /etc/make.conf
	# To avoid building sendmail
	NO_SENDMAIL=	true
	bash-2.03$ 

;->I'm aware that you disagree, and I don't begrudge you that right.
;->But I would like you to be made aware that there are many of us
;->out here who feel that the FreeBSD way meets our needs better than
;->stuffing absolutely everything that anyone can figure out how to
;->put into an RPM into one directory tree.

I understand that. My problem isn't that everything isn't shoved into
/usr. My problem is that the standard name space for locally-supported
packages has been coopted by part of the FreeBSD distribution. I'd be
equally happy if it were /opt, /packages, /usr/packages, or something
similar (/lets/make/mike/type/a/lot would make me unhappy, mind you
:-).

I'm not pushing for that to change - I realize how much work it would
be - but I'm going to exercise the option to complain about it if an
appropriate moment comes up and I've been bitten by it recently.

	<mike



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