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Date:      Wed, 26 Aug 1998 10:43:28 -0700 (PDT)
From:      Gary Kline <kline@tao.thought.org>
To:        remy@synx.com
Cc:        freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Ports), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (Hackers Mailing List), Pierre.David@prism.uvsq.fr
Subject:   Re: Almost Back...
Message-ID:  <199808261743.KAA18134@tao.thought.org>
In-Reply-To: <199808261609.RAA03640@bsd.synx.com> from Remy NONNENMACHER at "Aug 26, 98 06:09:23 pm"

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According to Remy NONNENMACHER:
> On 26 Aug, Gary Kline wrote:
> > According to Remy NONNENMACHER:
> >> On 25 Aug, Gary Kline wrote:
> >> >.... 


	Remy, I am copiying the -ports and -hackers lists and 
	Pierre David who helped with the initial translations 
	into French.  

	I'd like whatever comments there are on the colon-spacing
	issues here.

		[[ ... ]]


> > 	Here is the message file from usr.bin/cmp.  You can ignore
> > 	number 2.  In French, 2 translates to ``2 cmp : %s : %s\n''
> > 	because of their grammar requiring whitespace after the  
> > 	colon.  
> >
> This is arguable !!. Imagine something like using a cut -f or an awk
> with a specific $N. This will cause the script to stop working (and
> will be hard to fix).
> 
> Also, old rules about placing the colons and semi-colons are deprecating
> in favor of a unique ponctuation without blank.
> 
> I Urge you (AFAIAC) not to change order nor number of 'fields' output.
>  


	The #2 message below only happens in ^error(filename) which
	does an error exit().  But your point is well taken for most
	if  not all output strings:: it might break scripts and 
	cause unnecessary grief.  

	I can see the English to French translation of

	``usage:''   to  ``utilisation :''

	perhaps.  Or in usage strings in #3, #4, and #5 below.  Places 
	where it would not break any scripts.

	What do others think?  This can be done either way; the 
	important thing, I think, is to do it correctly.


> > 
> > $
> > $
> > $ $Id: cmp.msg,v 1.1 1998/08/26 14:04:13 kline Exp kline $
> > $
> > $set 1
> > $quote "
> > 1 "%s %s differ: char %ld, line %ld\n"
> 1 "%s %s diffèrent: caractère %ld, ligne %ld\n"
> > 2 "cmp: %s: %s\n"
> 2 "cmp: %s: %s\n"
> > 3 "cmp: EOF on %s\n"
> 3 "cmp: EOF sur %s\n"
> 3 "cmp: Fin-de-fichier sur %s\n"
> 3 "cmp: FDF sur %s\n"


	My inclination is to go with ``fin-de-fichier'' to get away
	from a little of the Unix terseness in the French version.
	I wouldn't care for EOF to be rewritten ``end-of-file'' 
	only because I'm so used to it.

	Comments??


> > 4 "cmp: only one of -l and -s may be specified.\n"
> 4 "cmp: les options -l et -s sont exclusives l'une de l'autre.\n"
> 4 "cmp: -l et -s ne peuvent ^etre employés simultanément"


	Comments?  (Mine only upon request :)


>   (Note: ^e = ISO-8859-1 #EA)
> > 5 "cmp: standard input may only be specified once.\n"
> 5 "cmp: l'entrée standard ne peut ^etre spécifiée qu'une seule fois.\n"
> > 6 "usage: cmp [-l|s] file1 file2 [skip1] [skip2]\n"
> 6 "utilisation: cmp [-l|s] fichier1 fichier2 [saut1] [saut2]\n"
> > 
> > 
> > 	gary
> > 
> > 	PS:  I'd like to set up a review group in each language 
> > 	in case there are disagreements on specific wordings.
> > 	My bias is to aim toward clarity rather than brevity or
> > 	literalness.   
> >
> 
> I agree: it's *IMPERATIV*; Multiple translators would produce different
> terms for one word depending on context. To avoid the multiplication of
> expressions, it's necessary to setup a short word to expression
> dictionnary that all translators would agree on and apply.


	Yes:: dictionary!  I've used to German variants for ``usage''
	and this needs to be resolved; having an expression-dictionary
	that was agreeable to the majority would have obviated this
	problem.


> 

	[[ ... ]]

	A public thanks to everyone who has answered.  To answer 
	one thing that I didn't make explicit, this internationalization
	effort very much welcomes _every_ language.  If you can create
	a <utility>.msg file for your language, I'll include it in the
	<utility>/nls/<LANG>/<utility>.msg directory.

	gary


> 


-- 
   Gary D. Kline         kline@tao.thought.org          Public service uNix


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