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Date:      Sat, 15 Dec 2007 02:06:44 -0800
From:      David Southwell <david@vizion2000.net>
To:        freebsd-ports@freebsd.org
Cc:        Paul Schmehl <pauls@utdallas.edu>
Subject:   Re: Limitations of Ports System
Message-ID:  <200712150206.46161.david@vizion2000.net>
In-Reply-To: <8B7776E2EBA2B5F1EEA02492@paul-schmehls-powerbook59.local>
References:  <475F7390.9090509@gmail.com> <47632BFE.6000801@brianwhalen.net> <8B7776E2EBA2B5F1EEA02492@paul-schmehls-powerbook59.local>

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On Friday 14 December 2007 18:44:09 Paul Schmehl wrote:
> --On December 14, 2007 5:21:02 PM -0800 Brian <bri@brianwhalen.net> wrote:
> > Information does indeed need to be gathered, and while even the ports
> > list will only grab a small percentage of FreeBSD users, other options
> > would likely grab a lot less.  Plus, most of the users here are
> > knowledgeable enough to give decent input.  For those of you that don't
> > like change may I suggest the book that led to
> > http://www.whomovedmycheese.com/.  It is really in all of our best
> > interest to have the product evolve, the alternative is much worse.
>
> This really is getting quite irritating.  Not one person on this list has
> *ever* said they don't want to entertain new ideas for ports.  Not one
> person on this list has said they don't like change.  *All* of the
> complaints have been along the lines of "go write some code and stop
> filling up this list with posts".  And that is *precisely* the point.
>
> Yet the proponents of the Aryeh bandwagon keep throwing up this straw man
> that those of us who have tired of the useless back and forth are refusing
> to listen and uninterested in change, when *nothing* could be further from
> the truth.  ports@ is *not* a development list.  Its purpose is to provide
> news about ports, discuss problems with ports, get advice on porting and
> so forth.  Or, to quote its charter, "Discussions concerning FreeBSD's
> =E2=80=9Cports collection=E2=80=9D (/usr/ports), ports infrastructure, an=
d general
> ports coordination efforts. This is a technical mailing list for which
> strictly technical content is expected."
>
> Get that?  "Strictly technical".  "How do you feel about the present
> design" or "what don't you like about the present design" or "if you could
> change something about ports, what would it be" are *not* appropriate
> discussions for this list.
>
> It's time to move this "discussion" to some place where those that *care*
> about coding and/or redesigning the ports system can participate and
> discuss code and return this list to its original purpose.  The only
> FreeBSD list that would be appropriate (if that - it's not really) would
> be arch, which is for architecture and design discussions.  This thread is
> a design discussion and does not belong here.  Please move it to a more
> appropriate place and leave this list alone.  Ask the FreeBSD maintainers
> to create a new list "ports-design@" if you like, but please stop the
> discussions here.  They are inappropriate for this list.
>
> And stop lying about the motivations of the many talented people who have
> asked, politely and otherwise, to stop.
>
I think you have been very politely asked to stop highjacking perfectly=20
legitimate discussion by trolling. If you do not want to contribute=20
positively please use your delete key. In accordance with the charter you=20
describe please make some technical contributions in accordance with the=20
charter.=20

I have already indicated the dangers of loss of credibility that follows fr=
om=20
any autocratic assumptions that any one individual is entitled to be=20
prescriptive. I do not think you are entitled to assume that your side of t=
he=20
argument has a monopoly of talent. IMHO we can all do without incessant=20
hectoring, lecturing and bullying and more collegially expressed=20
contributions on topic.=20

This thread is entitled "The limits of the Ports System" not "Why we should=
=20
not discuss the limts of the ports system". If you have nothing to say on=20
topic then please be humble and keep quiet

Thank you





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