Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 22:33:27 +1100 From: Sue Blake <sue@welearn.com.au> To: Studded <Studded@san.rr.com> Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: newbies mailing list Message-ID: <19980303223327.16588@welearn.com.au> In-Reply-To: <34FB42E9.284874EC@san.rr.com>; from Studded on Mon, Mar 02, 1998 at 03:38:17PM -0800 References: <Pine.BSF.3.96.980301210912.26963A-100000@andrsn.stanford.edu> <34FA9C54.777800CE@san.rr.com> <19980303004002.42687@welearn.com.au> <34FB42E9.284874EC@san.rr.com>
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On Mon, Mar 02, 1998 at 03:38:17PM -0800, Studded wrote:
> Sue Blake wrote:
>
> [snippage]
>
> > Doug, I've read your next email and it seems you're still catching up with
> > the discussion and throwing comments in while the ideas are fresh. That's
> > fine, but it might be a little early to respond to them.
>
> Your assumption is incorrect. In fact, I read all of the posts in the
> thread and thought carefully about them before I replied. Please don't
> assume that because I haven't reached the same conclusion you have that
> I don't adequately understand the topic.
Nope. Now that it's clear you haven't missed anything we can be content to
disagree.
> > Let me just clarify that I'm not trying to solve all support problems, or
> > all newbies problems. I'm trying to focus on one thing. If the discussion
> > leads people to want to work on other things that's great, but I'm not going
> > to have time to be sidetracked.
>
> Yes, I think you've identified what I perceive to be a fairly
> substantial problem. You want a newbies mailing list. You want to focus
> your attention on that goal to the exclusion of all else, including the
> discussion regarding whether or not that is the best way to help new
> users. In an attempt to avoid further confusion, let me state explicitly
> what I attempted to say tactfully in my previous letter.
That was tact?? Style noted for future reference.
> I think your narrow mindedness regarding this issue is dangerous, and I
> think that you could end up doing more harm than good by providing a
> superficial "solution" to what is actually a very important part of the
> FreeBSD project.
What is it you're referring to here, general support? My aim is not to
address that. I don't know enough to. And sure, if I were narrowminded and
dangerous I might be the last to see it. All I can do is restate that what I
and some other newbies want is our own space. Our own space. I'm too stupid
to understand why that's so hard to make you understand. Somehow I can't
find a way to ask for it without making everyone else feel slighted. Sorry,
but it is very hard to stand up and ask and I'm just doing the best I can.
> > I don't think anyone needs to feel threatened by the prospect of newbies
> > taking over,
>
> I don't think anyone does. In the abscence of evidence to the contrary
> I will avoid categorizing your attempt to attribute the arguments of
> those who have valid disagreements with your perspective as ignorance
> and fear to malice on your part. I will instead assume that your zeal to
> accomplish your goal has clouded your judgement.
>
> As it turns out, not only do I have a lot of experience providing end
> user support both in person and over the internet, I actually get paid
> to do it. I will avoid further tooting of my own horn, and would like to
> have avoided it altogether except that I think it will help serve to
> dispel the notion that I don't actually understand the topic at hand.
I only save a few answers from -questions that make sense and will be
useful, and a lot of them are from you. Yes, I'm well aware of your skills
and willingness to use them. It saddens me that you and people like you
might take this attempt to get a newbies mailing list up as a negative
comment on the level of support. It is most definitely not. It's not about
you, it's about us.
I can't argue with any more of what you've said. We've heard each other's
points of view but we don't seem to agree on much. Maybe that's because I'm
naive and selfish and narrow-minded and can't see it from your more
realistic perspective. How would I know. You have lots more knowledge than
me, lots more experience, and have done more for others. Alongside you,
nothing I can say has equal weight. You may reply, but I'm gonna feel pretty
mute in this environment.
--
Regards,
-*Sue*-
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