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Date:      Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:52:26 +1030 (CST)
From:      Michael Smith <msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au>
To:        uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV)
Cc:        hackers@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: Watchdog timer
Message-ID:  <199602050522.PAA06529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au>
In-Reply-To: <m0tjHnY-000CFIC@nemesis.lonestar.org> from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 4, 96 09:41:00 pm

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Frank Durda IV stands accused of saying:
> [18]Hmm.  I'd do this internally, presuming that resetting would be enough.
> [18]It's not actually as simple as you make it sound though; you need a
> [18]missing-pulse detector (consider the situation where the disk light stays
> [18]on) and a timer that runs for longer than the 100-second maximum for the
> [18]555.
> 
> Two things:  first, you must assume that if the activity light stays
> on for the maximum amount of time, this is a crash.  I have several
> systems that crash from time to time and they can be spotted visually
> because the IDE access light is stuck on.   No panic, just off in la-la
> land but the IDE light is on solid.  The timer, however implemented,
> must re-arm on rising or falling edge transitions (doesn't have to be both),
> not on levels to avoid ignoring crashes while disk access was
> still in progress and not completed.

Assuming you're using an opto for the input (common sense), this requires
two resistors, a capacitor and a diode.  A nuisance to load, admittedly,
but not hard to implement, and an absolute must. (Really an edge detector
rather than a missing-pulse detector)

> [18]This (the power cycling) would add significantly to the cost of the unit;
> [18]consider a 15A relay and the extra wiring involved in terms of assembly 
> [18]cost.
> 
> No doubt, and the pricing I mentioned reflects this.  Probably I would
> simply buy load control modules which several companies make.  They are
> meant for traffic control signal applications.  They just look for 5V
> and activate a load, usually using a 10A solid state relay which will
> handle the inductive load of a switching power supply just fine.

Er, I beg to vary, if not differ here.  Switching power supplies have 
very nasty dV/dt characteristics, which quickly runs you into the more
expensive SSRs.  These don't compare terribly favourably cost-wise with
12V coil DPST 15A line relays, but do have the advantage of requiring less
in the way of support parts.

> Controlling power is clearly not a feature for everybody, but is something
> that can be easily added or not added since there are so few components
> and drill-outs involved in the delta.  I would probably use it in
> important systems that aren't staffed 24 hours a day.

Certainly supporting an external power-tripping relay would be desirable.

You mentioned FCC rules regarding oscillators; how fast does the osc. have
to be before they get in a tizz?  (eg. consider a 74HC4060 at 5Hz or so)

> Frank Durda IV <uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org>|"If you say bad things about

-- 
]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer        msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au    [[
]] Genesis Software                     genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au   [[
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