Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2020 10:22:05 +0000 From: Bob Bishop <rb@gid.co.uk> To: Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org> Cc: Paul Mather <paul@gromit.dlib.vt.edu>, freebsd-arm <freebsd-arm@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: Showstoppers for RPI3 Message-ID: <51C45D52-EAD4-42A3-9EC8-B0B53C9D61BA@gid.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <49fce4489ba4aeb7a5638a6c1bbfb5e6a0b84312.camel@freebsd.org> References: <20200225175446.GA77976@www.zefox.net> <11951E01-EC13-4FBB-938A-AEB5700C4281@yahoo.com> <CACNAnaEiv5NZZz%2BxfETkhSZ-zbjZ3Ya6z7pyteheP4zj3EK1Gg@mail.gmail.com> <20200226052045.GA79939@www.zefox.net> <E866B6BE-7948-4412-82EF-999A2F8C0DF9@googlemail.com> <04e8e290e5d7bb810f76ece4ff33d6e1006e63cd.camel@freebsd.org> <9AF20341-AFCC-46BE-A2F2-96CF01655983@gromit.dlib.vt.edu> <49fce4489ba4aeb7a5638a6c1bbfb5e6a0b84312.camel@freebsd.org>
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Hi, > On 26 Feb 2020, at 21:21, Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org> wrote: >=20 > On Wed, 2020-02-26 at 15:41 -0500, Paul Mather wrote: >> On Feb 26, 2020, at 10:33 AM, Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org> wrote: >>=20 >>> On Wed, 2020-02-26 at 06:32 +0100, Klaus K=C3=BCchemann via = freebsd-arm >>> wrote: >>>> But that=C2=B4s the absolute joke of the century :-) that these = issues >>>> last so long here on the mailing list=20 >>>=20 >>> The current freebsd-arm devs keep pointing out that nobody is >>> especially interested in maintaining or working on rpi* stuff at >>> all.=20 >>> Why in the world would you be surprised that nobody is working on >>> it? >>>=20 >>> If you want to run freebsd on arm hardware, try using hardware that >>> people are actually working to support. If you must use crappy rpi >>> hardware, either run linux on it, or consider paying someone to do >>> the >>> freebsd support you need. Complaining that nobody will work for >>> free >>> on hardware they hate working on is just... >>> complaining. Pointlessly. >>=20 >>=20 >> All fair enough. I'm probably in the same boat as Bob Prohaska >> inasmuch as I have a couple of Raspberry Pi devices of varying >> vintages hanging around. I'm a longtime FreeBSD user, so, naturally, >> I prefer to run FreeBSD on these devices, and have done so for a >> while (with varying degrees of success/stability). >>=20 >> It sounds from the above I shouldn't bother, for pain and misery will >> attend me all my days as a result. :-) >>=20 >> If Raspberry Pi is a crappy platform and a bad choice to use, >> FreeBSD-wise, what is the suggested alternative in the same low- >> power/low-price (and Raspberry Pi-like spec) arena? Is it the Pine64 >> stuff like the PINE A64, ROCK64, and ROCKPro64?? >>=20 >> I'm willing to buy something other than Raspberry Pi (I have a >> BeagleBone Black, for example), but I don't want to buy something >> that is derided and despised by FreeBSD developers and avoided by >> them like the plague. I am not an ARM/SoC or electronics expert, so >> I feel unqualified to know what is a "crappy ARM platform." >>=20 >> Also, if the true situation with Raspberry Pi is that it is unlikely >> to see development within FreeBSD, it would be more honest to >> deprecate the platform officially on the FreeBSD site. I'd even go >> so far as to suggest not to distribute official images for it, as >> that carries with it a hint of blessing and support. >>=20 >> Cheers, >>=20 >> Paul. >=20 > It really is pretty specific to the rpi family, for a pair of reasons: >=20 > - The hardware is just crappy, buggy, limited, hard to work with. Depends what you are trying to do with it. We are using FreeBSD on Pi = zero in embedded systems, all the I/O is via GPIO and it=E2=80=99s easy = to use and works just fine. It=E2=80=99s **WAY** cheaper than any = comparable solution short of dealing directly with the SoC and we = don=E2=80=99t have the volume for that. > - Documentation needed to write device drivers is not openly > available, and getting an NDA in place with broadcom never seems to > happen despite people over the years saying they would work to make it > happen. That is admittedly a problem.=20 > For inexpensive low-power boards... For the 32-bit world, the > Allwinnner hardware is probably best supported, with imx6 a close > second. For 64-bit I'd say it's the rockpro stuff. >=20 > -- Ian -- Bob Bishop rb@gid.co.uk
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