Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:09:37 +0200 From: Cynic <cynic@mail.cz> To: Bill Moran <wmoran@iowna.com> Cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Justification for using FreeBSD Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20010615145326.02094360@mail.cz> In-Reply-To: <3B2A029C.107C0014@iowna.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20010615015821.02135168@mail.cz> <5.1.0.14.2.20010615015821.02135168@mail.cz> <5.1.0.14.2.20010615055641.03f5dba0@mail.cz>
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Hi there,
At 14:42 15.6. 2001, Bill Moran wrote the following:
--------------------------------------------------------------
>Cynic wrote:
>> IIS isn't as crippled as you might think from the majority of opinions expressed
>> on unix-related mailing lists. My experience shows that most people would rather
>> die than admit something different from their favorite toy is ok (let alone a product
>> of the Redmond Satan!). IIS is just a web server, it has good points and bad points.
>> One of it's worst aspects is the fact that--since it's a "M$ crap"--it's one of the
>> most popular targets, and... Have you noticed how loudly the unix mob "applauds"
>> to every hole in anything from MS? however, it's quite different the other way
>> around. apache.org has been breached. if I weren't subscribed to the new-httpd@
>> list, I wouldn't know. toye.php.net has been breached. If I weren't a PHP developer
>> taking part in PHP's QA I wouldn't know. see my point? you can happily move any
>> "legacy" content to the IIS box, using either shlight (Sharity Light) or mod_proxy
>> (or mod_rewrite, if you wish so) to "hide" the IIS, and focus on FBSD/Apache.
>
>Let's keep things in perspective here ... The breach of Apache.org had
>nothing to do with the Apache web server. That same method of breach
>could have been used to breach ANY system - it was an admin error.
Sure, just like most of IIS defacements are an admin error--after all,
what else would you call failure to plug a known hole? :) (That's not to
say that was the case with apache.org!)
I don't dispute the "many eyes, shallow bugs" truth. I don't dispute
the fact that code written "because I want to" is inherently better than
code written just for money. And I never wanted to sound like putting
something in your mouth. But the concerns rootman expressed about
the IIS box on their LAN made me feel like he was afraid it would
die every 2 hours just because it's IIS. My experience suggests
something different, and all I wanted to say was that he could
easily let the NT box live if that option required the smallest amount of
work. That's all.
>I'm not familiar with the toye.php.net breach, so I can't really comment
>there.
Mailing lists have been down for three weeks. Rasmus Lerdorf is looking
for a new home for the server.
>And I have never said (and will never say) that IIS is "crippled". I
>have said and will repeat that it's expensive, slow, non-standards
>compliant and difficult to customize compared to Apache. It does work,
>and can be used. I'm also not familiar with the newest version (since
>I've stopped using it) so my information could be a bit out of date.
>If you want to know which which is better, security wise, check out
>bugtraq and other such services and see who has more reported problems.
>Then decide for yourself.
I'm not touting IIS. I wouldn't use Apache if I was an IIS fan. I just
wanted to bring in a bit of a relaxed attitude, since vast majority of
discussions like IIS vs Apache, MS foo vs OS bar tend to be largely
religion-based -- on both sides, of course. Again, I'm not saying
anything about _your_ posts. Ok? :)
>> Well, while very standards-focused, the apache developers know that a strict
>> implementation would lead the popularity of apache south. :) they provide hacks, which
>> are enabled by default. Of course, these are often minor problems showing up in
>> border situations. Or you might not notice at all. (that is nothing to say about
>> other browsers!)
>
>True ... it's funny to read through the config file and see the
>allowances that are made for certain browsers that are known to be
>broken.
>
>--
>If a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush,
>then what can I get for two hands in the bush?
>
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------end of quote------
cynic@mail.cz
-------------
And the eyes of them both were opened and they saw that their files
were world readable and writable, so they chmoded 600 their files.
- Book of Installation chapt 3 sec 7
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