Skip site navigation (1)Skip section navigation (2)
Date:      Tue, 20 Aug 2013 20:14:11 +0200
From:      Terje Elde <terje@elde.net>
To:        Adam Vande More <amvandemore@gmail.com>
Cc:        frank2@fjl.co.uk, FreeBSD Questions <freebsd-questions@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: VPN where local private address collide
Message-ID:  <01ED803C-F130-4A51-8AEE-FB60CF4CBD05@elde.net>
In-Reply-To: <CA%2BtpaK16UpCTagewUojKz_UTwSSgXhsqrWuv7nsp-Wxv%2B06W%2BA@mail.gmail.com>
References:  <520E5EC0.5090105@fjl.co.uk> <9FB6809B-DD5D-4A04-8BD9-0271FAC03181@elde.net> <520F53A2.80707@fjl.co.uk> <B86F8EA5-67BE-4791-8CAE-6E70BB326500@elde.net> <520F8AA8.8030407@fjl.co.uk> <1FF39756-0555-4CD8-95B7-862F9644CF78@elde.net> <CA%2BtpaK1kG5BtKjO%2BFrSXwkgTJ_k5K7HxtL8vih7Mq%2Bb7r6KYWg@mail.gmail.com> <791847EC-8E72-4013-9157-7AD0ACB62A7D@elde.net> <CA%2BtpaK16UpCTagewUojKz_UTwSSgXhsqrWuv7nsp-Wxv%2B06W%2BA@mail.gmail.com>

next in thread | previous in thread | raw e-mail | index | archive | help
On Aug 20, 2013, at 8:33 AM, Adam Vande More <amvandemore@gmail.com> =
wrote:
> and while you can rewrite that on a NAT-box using an application level =
gateway, you can not do that if the session is using SSL or TLS.
>=20
> Complete BS.

This seems to come down to a misunderstanding in the examples drawn up, =
and of TCP/IP-headers (outside the SSL/TLS encryption) and SIP-headers =
(inside the SSL/TLS encryption).

Noone is arguing that SSL/TLS would give any troubles with changing TCP =
or IP-headers during NAT, and that part seams clear both to the OP and =
myself.

It's the SIP-headers inside an encrypted SSL/TLS-session that a =
NAT-layer wouldn't be able to change, even if it wanted to (and arguably =
outside the scope of NAT).

> I was referring to headers *inside* the SSL/TLS-layers.  I thought =
that was obvious, but I see I might not have been clear enough.
>=20
> Not clear in the least.  Expanding on what is so difficult about might =
do a lot of us some good.

Read up if you'd like:

http://www.mail-archive.com/freebsd-questions@freebsd.org/msg268807.html

I'm not quite sure what part isn't clear, so please email me if there is =
anything.  Preferrably off-list, this tread seems to be stearing towards =
you calling BS based on a misunderstanding, and that's probably not =
adding a lot of value to -questions.

> Yes, you can often still resolve it on the server, but just how messy =
does one want to get stacking workaround on top of workaround,
>=20
> Despite your protestations to the contrary,  NAT and SIP work quite =
weil together in basic configurations including TLS and the OP's =
scenario.   I can't explain your difficulties but perhaps when you =
aren't at a mobile device you could answer a question in depth.
>=20
>=20
> The server would register that the phone is available at 192.168.0.200 =
(locally, in lan_b), while the server would actually need to send to =
192.168.2.200, in order to reach 192.168.0.200 in lan_a.
> =20
>=20
> Exactly how this would behave depends on a lot of factors, but you'd =
quickly end up with a situation in which the phone *appears* to work, =
can register against the server and call out (both client-initiated), =
but where incoming calls just don't work (sent to 192.168.0.200 in =
lan_b, rather than in lan_a).
>=20
> Could you could post your config to demonstrate what you are doing =
incorrectly?

I'm not doing anything incorrectly or otherwise, and I'm not having any =
difficulties with anything.  I drew up an example, to illustrate a =
point.

And I know very well that NAT and SIP with TLS *can* work quite well in =
such a setup.  In fact, I'm even arguing it.  If the server does the =
right thing in a non-standard scenario, things can work quite well out =
of the box even.  However, if the server doesn't do the right thing in =
this scenario, you might have a good bunch of debugging on your hands.

I've never argued that you can't get it to work, I'm arguing that the =
farther away from standards you go, the more you might break and have to =
fix or find workarounds for.

Terje




Want to link to this message? Use this URL: <https://mail-archive.FreeBSD.org/cgi/mid.cgi?01ED803C-F130-4A51-8AEE-FB60CF4CBD05>