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Date:      Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:59:31 -0400
From:      John Baldwin <jhb@freebsd.org>
To:        Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>
Cc:        danfe@freebsd.org, marcel@freebsd.org, svn-src-all@freebsd.org, src-committers@freebsd.org, svn-src-head@freebsd.org, des@des.no
Subject:   Re: svn commit: r184193 - in head/sys: arm/conf conf
Message-ID:  <200810271159.31843.jhb@freebsd.org>
In-Reply-To: <20081024.164740.74747369.imp@bsdimp.com>
References:  <868wsewzos.fsf@ds4.des.no> <200810241031.08780.jhb@freebsd.org> <20081024.164740.74747369.imp@bsdimp.com>

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On Friday 24 October 2008 06:47:40 pm Warner Losh wrote:
> From: John Baldwin <jhb@freebsd.org>
> Subject: Re: svn commit: r184193 - in head/sys: arm/conf conf
> Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:31:07 -0400
> 
> > On Friday 24 October 2008 09:27:03 am Alexey Dokuchaev wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 03:26:43AM +0200, Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav wrote:
> > > > Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> writes:
> > > > > We already have a better mechanism for including config files.  We
> > > > > should be using that instead of poluting another port with the
> > > > > DEFAULTS file.
> > > > 
> > > > Should we even have DEFAULTS files at all?  IMHO they just confuse
> > > > matters by introducing "stealth" options into your config.
> > > 
> > > I tend to second this.  I always try to get everything possible out of
> > > my kernel to modules, and thus was surprised to see io.ko and mem.ko
> > > fail to load because they were silently included into my custom kernel.
> > > 
> > > I understand that some things like 'device isa' and
> > > 'device npx' aren't really optional, but if something is useful to have,
> > > but can be loaded as a module, it belongs to GENERIC rather than
> > > DEFAULTS.  Killing the latter altogether and throwing a comment that
> > > says particular option or device is mandatory in GENERIC is probably
> > > even better (and more transparent).
> > 
> > The one thing I think DEFAULTS is useful for are replacing NO_FOO options 
with 
> > FOO options.  That is, if someone wants to turn a feature on by default, 
I'd 
> > rather them put 'options FOO' in DEFAULTS rather than rename all the 
> > #ifdef's,e tc. to '#ifndef NO_FOO'.
> 
> Wouldn't it be better to move to a system where we explicitly include
> std.i386 and have them all defined there?  We already encourage stuff
> like this with advice to include GENERIC with nodev...

I wouldn't mind a std.i386, and if we make config's include keyword fall back 
to 'sys/conf' for relative path name lookups if the lookup in '.' fails then 
you can even put those files in sys/conf with the still-clean syntax 
of 'include std.i386'.

However, I don't know about you, but I _never_ build a config by including 
GENERIC and then weeding stuff out.  Too much stuff to weed out.  Once I have 
a customized config for a machine I then include that in development branches 
to install kernels to different directories under /boot, etc.

-- 
John Baldwin



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