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Date:      Tue, 04 Jul 2000 11:50:55 +0100
From:      Tim Priebe <tim@polytechnic.edu.na>
To:        "Louis A. Mamakos" <louie@TransSys.COM>
Cc:        David Gilbert <dgilbert@velocet.ca>, Joerg Micheel <joerg@cs.waikato.ac.nz>, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Ethernet MTUs > 1500?
Message-ID:  <3961C18F.E8753501@polytechnic.edu.na>
References:  <14689.22689.894466.908666@trooper.velocet.net> <20000704153914.C60136@cs.waikato.ac.nz> <14689.23903.87264.511506@trooper.velocet.net> <200007040353.XAA03131@whizzo.transsys.com> <14689.27160.907313.347624@trooper.velocet.net> <200007040508.BAA59763@whizzo.transsys.com>

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"Louis A. Mamakos" wrote:
> 
> > >>>>> "Louis" == Louis A Mamakos <louie@TransSys.COM> writes:
> >
> > Louis> There's some confusion here, because the MTU is typically
> > Louis> associated with a protocol stack like IP and refers to the
> > Louis> largest sized (IP in this case) packet that can be sent on the
> > Louis> network interface.  In the case of Ethernet interfaces that
> > Louis> support and use VLAN tags, the MTU is still 1500 bytes,
> > Louis> regardless of the fact that the frame size is a few bytes
> > Louis> longer to accomodate the VLAN tag information.
> >
> > Louis> So, this has no effect on the Ethernet type field (or 802.3
> > Louis> length fields) since the higher level protocol packet size is
> > Louis> unchanged.
> >
> > Why, then, are the vlan MTUs hardwired at 1496?
> 
> You got me.  Perhaps the code is busted.  Perhaps the code is trying
> to accomodate ethernet NICs that cannot send or receive larger
> than "normal" ethernet frames.  (e.g., those with VLAN tags or
> priority labels).
> 
> I just know that on networks that I've built and used with Ethernet
> switches which use VLAN tagging, I've had no problems transporting
> 1500 byte MTU IP packets inside of ethernet frames.  If the NIC card
> in the FreeBSD host can't send the larger frames to accomodate the
> VLAN tags, then it's broken.

From the days I was last getting this to work ~3.2-RELEASE, the real
problem is not an MTU of 1496 (unless it is a router), but an MRU of
1496. From what I rembember fixing it to send the extra 4 bytes was not
that difficult. I eventually fixed my firewall, to mostly function with
a MTU and MRU of 1500 on the vlan interfaces, but at the cost that it
would spontaniously reboot if you tried to establish a tcp connection.
This has not been a real problem for me, but has been for some others
that report the same behaviour, and wanted to use it in a web server.

I think it is probably time to have a policy decision, that we are
willing support the 802.1Q and 802.1p frames on equipment that is able
to send and recieve the extra 4 bytes per frame. Then a framework can be
developed to support this with out too much additional overhead in the
drivers. I am willing to put some time in to this.

For clarification, I am not suggesting that we need to look at
prioritisation of packets, based on 802.1p, at this time, just stop
discarding them if they are "too big".

Tim.


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