Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2000 13:09:26 +0100 (CET) From: Micke Josefsson <mj@isy.liu.se> To: Bob Martin <bob@inu.net> Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: About introducing newbies to FreeBSD Message-ID: <XFMail.001102130926.mj@isy.liu.se> In-Reply-To: <3A009637.9491FE09@inu.net>
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On 01-Nov-00 Bob Martin wrote: > Micke Josefsson wrote: >> >> On freebsd-questions there is now a thread 'Beginners with bsd'. As some of >> it >> has a bearing on advocacy and I have recent experience of this perhaps you >> will >> be interested. > > ---> snip <---- > >> Do you have any comments on this? I'd love to hear them. >> >> Cheers, >> /Micke >> >> ---------------------------------- >> Michael Josefsson, MSEE >> mj@isy.liu.se >> >> This message was sent by XFMail >> running on FreeBSD 3.5-STABLE >> ---------------------------------- > > I think the context of the "newbie" is the real issue here. Years ago I > watched a friend, with tons of Apple (NOT MacIntosh) experience give up > on an install of Win95. I have never met an Irix, SCO, DEC Unix, or > Solaris admin that had trouble installing xBSD, but have seen members of > that same group fight with installs of both Linux and NT. FreeBSD > "inherited" it's installation concept from BSD, which in turn, was based > on AT&T Unix. So there is a similarity in the way Unices derived from > that environment behave. > > Since most of our new users come to us from either Windows or Linux, we > need an installation program that is a lot more like the ones that > they've used in the past. I've often wondered how many users we loose > while they are trying to load the OS. What I would really like to see is > a FreeBSD installer on par with the UnixWare 7 or Tru64 5.0 installers. > (A clone of SCO Admin would be nice too!) Failing that, we probably need > something that looks more like a Linux installer, or a really good > rosetta stone. Well, what about a new alternative to selecting Standard, Express or Custom installation then? A 'Newbie' selection where one does not have to answer all the incomprehensible stuff about 'Do you want this to be a leaf node' (what the h**k is a leaf node anyway, the newbie surely will ask) and whether this machine is an NFS server or not. Many of these questions are merely confusing and have reasonable defaults (yes it is a leaf node, no it is not an NFS server, no I dont want anonymous connections etc). If you are not happy with these defaults then run sysinstall again after the machine has succesfully booted. The first boot is a milestone I do not think one should ignore. I think there is a long way from hearing about FreeBSD to actually getting a CD and then another long stretch to dare to install it. The other partitions may go away, the menus clearly says so. A successful first boot is a real triumph over the silicon. Let the 'Newbie install' go through the partitioning of the disk to select where to install FreeBSD, but force it to use Defaults for partition sizes. He/she wants to setup a keyboard and mouse (and timezone?) but not necessarily IP and anonymous ftp etc. Skip the source, but make a selection of X or not. If X is selected then install every Xserver at once - yes it consumes space but the XF86Setup will be easier, most people don't know the exact name of their graphics card anyway. Sidenote: I always install the system first, then reboot and only after that I try to install X. The risks involved with accidentally or unknowingly selecting the wrong monitor frequencies or graphics card are to high. Many graphics cards have confusingly similar names, too. If I fail installing X when doing the first time install I will have to (well, likely anyway) reinstall everything. Anger, confusion, and generally a feeling of failure will soon appear. Am I the only one doing it this way? With this kind of easier setup I definately believe that many more people will manage to do a successful install. It is only then the fun starts! Of course many are not ready to dig deep into the root role, and why should they? For home use, adding packages from CD is often enough (or am I wrong here). While at it: Why not include a file with pointers to information resources? freebsd-questions mailinglist, comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc, daemonnews.org, bsdtoday.com for example. Another of my 2 öre. /Micke > > -- > Bob Martin > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message ---------------------------------- Michael Josefsson, MSEE mj@isy.liu.se This message was sent by XFMail running on FreeBSD 3.5-STABLE ---------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message
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