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Date:      Fri, 17 Jul 2020 02:05:50 -0700
From:      Don Wilde <>
To:        Polytropon <>
Cc:        FreeBSD Mailing List <>,
Subject:   Re: URGENT: Microsoft overwrites boot loader!
Message-ID:  <>
In-Reply-To: <>
References:  <> <>

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On 7/16/20 11:53 PM, Polytropon wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Jul 2020 13:19:51 -0700, Don Wilde wrote:
>> The [deleted] ones in Redmond have done it again. My multi-OS GRUB2 boot
>> loader is gone, and in its place is a 500M partition called 'Windows
>> boot loader'.
> They do this all the time. The consensus here is to install
> "Windows" first, always, restricted to the designated disk
> space, and _then_ install Linux, FreeBSD, GRUB, or anything
> else non-"Windows", in order to avoid the exact problem you
> are describing. Even older versions of "Windows" were known
> to destroy things like the FreeBSD boot manager when they
> are installed as a 2nd choice. MICROS~1 always wants you to
> treat it first class, with golden feet and glockenspiel.
> However, is my interpretation correct? Did this happen when
> you _installed_ "Windows" on that machine for the first time,
> or did it happen after you _booted_ an already installed
> instance of "Windows", which then did attack "foreign data"
> on the disk?
This machine still maintains the original Windows installation, first 
with W7, and then (finally, bad mistake) upgraded to W10.
>> The purpose is to force us to look at MS' new version of Edge. All my
>> old boot files are gone.
> Something like that should never happen. It's absolutely
> normal that "Windows" installs software without user consent,
> and then presents it prominently in user-configured areas
> such as the desktop, the "Start" menu, or the bottom bar
> (pun absolutely intended), but it should never exceed its
> authority beyong the border of the "Windows" partition,
> which clearly means: "Hands off of Grub partition!"

Yes. The bastards also screwed up my 128GB backup drive -- again without 
asking -- when I left it plugged in during a Doze boot.

> Especially with "Windows 10", the PC is no longer a PC,
> not a _personal_ computer belonging to the user; it's rather
> a system remotely controlled by MICROS~1, and having installed
> "Windows" and therefore agreed to the terms of usage (EULA),
> there is probably nothing "wrong" with it, because you have
> agreed that they can do whatever they want, and if something
> goes wrong, it's your fault. Legal business as usual.
Yes, agreed. They far outstrip the robber barons of the 1800s in their 
greed. Even Carnegie finally discovered a heart beating inside of 
himself, and gave us libraries and Napoleon Hill!
> Many years (or let's say, decades) I had a similar problem
> with an OS/2 installation: It messed up the system's partition
> table, a system where DOS (not that DOS, the other one) was
> installed, and there was a data loss: Partition D: became C:,
> E: became D:, F: became E:, and C: along with its content
> seemed to be gone. But in the overall "disk space calculation"
> it must still have been on disk, so I used the Norton Disk Editor
> (DISKEDIT.EXE from Norton Utilities, a great product at that
> time!), a handheld calculator and pen & paper to re-calculate
> the correct values for the partition table, entered them,
> rebooted, prayed unto the holy bringer of peace, Alpha-Omega,
> and tadaa, C: was there again, with the correct content.

I never had that wonderful luxury of being saddled with a "real" IBM 
machine or OS/2. One would note that they, too (along with MS, 
eventually), are being relegated to the dustbin of history where they 


>> That's the last time I will allow this, and I'm calling those [deleted]s
>> tomorrow to give them a piece of my mind. After that I will erase every
>> vestige of that obscene OS from my disk.
> They don't mind. They already have your money. And maybe they
> even have your name, address, phone number, credit card number
> or other banking information...
I have a few last resort technologies they *don't* know about, though 
they are not worth any more of my time or psychic energy. :D

Don Wilde
* What is the Internet of Things but a system      *
* of systems including humans?                     *

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