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Date:      Wed, 13 May 2020 09:48:38 -0500
From:      Valeri Galtsev <>
Subject:   mailman 3 on FreeBSD- or mailman replacement?
Message-ID:  <>

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Dear All,

I'm sure I'm not the only one who runs mailman on FreeBSD servers. Now 
that python 2.7 is about to go, mailman 2 will follow. There is mailman 
3 that is based on python 3. There is, however, no mailman 3 port. I 
wonder if someone already asked mailman port maintainer about mailman 3. 
I do not like to bother busy person(s) if someone already did.

Or, maybe, install it using pip (pip 3 with python v. 3.x) as mailman 
website describes for variety of scenarios? This basically brings server 
update one step towards mess.

I kept repeating to people I work for who start using python as 
significant part of their work environment: Python is a sneaky snake. 
Namely, python paces fast with changing internals version to version 
(meaning minor versions here, not only major one). Thus, variety of 
modules one starts using have to keep up, but some may lag behind, then 
one may get stuck to older version of something, forcing older version 
of everything. Not to mention this whole thing being update nightmare. 
All the time I was mentioning as a counter example: mailman. Though it 
is written in python, programmers are brilliant to use only fundamental 
things, thus resulting in product that never brings you any trouble (I 
mean here myself). I have a bad feeling I can't say the same anymore. 
One of the indications is: they offer docker container with mailman 3, 
which in my book indicates exactly that bad thing: "we need a bunch of 
other things which we can not predict to exist or change in a future, so 
it is hard to guarantee we will live in some general up-to-date 
environment of variety of modern systems... so we give you composed 
environment that will guarantee or product to work in..."

I am really upset by my own thoughts. That said, we all know nothing 
lasts forever. The decision to use mailman was made a couple of decades 
ago. So, the choice was right, really long lasting, which I'm still 
happy about.

This all leads me to my second question: maybe it is time to replace 
mailman with some other maillist suite. If someone already made this 
decision, could you share the reasons, and your new choice:

Replacement for mailman?


Valeri Galtsev
Sr System Administrator
Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics
Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics
University of Chicago
Phone: 773-702-4247

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