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Date:      Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:36:19 +0200
From:      Rahul Siddharthan <rsidd@online.fr>
To:        Terry Lambert <tlambert2@mindspring.com>
Cc:        Alexey Dokuchaev <danfe@regency.nsu.ru>, Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group <Cy.Schubert@uumail.gov.bc.ca>, arch@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: Package system wishlist
Message-ID:  <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr>
In-Reply-To: <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com>
References:  <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com>

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Terry Lambert wrote:
> Rahul Siddharthan wrote:
> > > It is a prerequisite for:
> > >
> > > o       Ability to do binary upgrades of the base system in order to
> > >         automatically (e.g. via cron) obtain, and optionally install,
> > >         security and other fixes.
> > 
> > For people who are running -release, what about having an executable
> > shell script, which contains uuencoded patched binaries and, when
> > executed, unpacks them and installs them to the proper locations (like
> > the shell-script "installers" provided by some commercial software
> > vendors), overwriting the old binaries?
> 
> o	I would like to be able to run a cron job that fetches a
> 	file of path names to files that are part of my current
> 	release, and known to have had security problems, and
> 	corresponding MD5 hashes of the fixed files, to compare
> 	to, and issue a security report and/or automatically add
> 	security patches to the system.

I still don't see why you need a packaging system for that.  Why not

1. Issue each security alert in two pieces, consisting of a list of 
   affected files and a binary-upgrade shell script;
2. Download the list, and if you're affected, download the
   shell-script and run it.  The shell script could have an MD5 hash
   as a whole, issued by the FreeBSD project; this would be the
   complete "binary patch" for the problem.

> o	I would like to be able to redefine any release from being
> 	"Release X" to "Release X plus all relevent security patches"
> 	or "Release X plus all relevent security and performance
> 	patches", as a site local option.
> 
> This is mostly an issue for an installed system with poor upgrade
> prospects, but a long life expectancy, e.g. for RackSpace.com or
> a similar situation.
> 
> The combinatorics for a large number of patches which accumulate
> slowly over time end up making this problematic.

True with source patches, but not with binary upgrades, as far as I
can see.  If you install the most recent updates in any category, you
should be safe.  If you're doing this via a cron job, you'll anyway be
installing each upgrade immediately as it comes out.  Since the fixes
for a -release will not involve major upgrades of system components
(eg openssh 2.9 -> 3.4), only minor patches, even if you miss an
update somewhere it shouldn't affect the compatibility of the next
update.  If you skipped update 1 and applied update 2 for openssh, the
worst that can happen is that you missed a security fix which came
with update 1 (and if you're lucky, the relevant files got overwritten
by update 2 anyway). 

Or am I missing something here?

- Rahul

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