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Date:      Sun, 09 Aug 2015 15:29:34 -0700
From:      Jordan Hubbard <jordanhubbard@me.com>
To:        Peter Jeremy <peter@rulingia.com>
Cc:        Bill Sorenson <instructionset@gmail.com>, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, "K. Macy" <kmacy@freebsd.org>, Kevin Bowling <kevin.bowling@kev009.com>
Subject:   Re: Sparc64 support
Message-ID:  <6C12EBFE-EAA9-4C12-9F03-1CB2C28C4A6E@me.com>
In-Reply-To: <20150809215403.GC20238@server.rulingia.com>
References:  <CACcTwYmS1c5uoO-WiJQDwgqYAevX7WZ7ZrP297hnOu7cNET3CA@mail.gmail.com> <mq3sg1$bno$1@ger.gmane.org> <CACcTwYnU=E-6sV3yLh3yKUSPZOg7967XV5ToXoSVPuNfOjF7hQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAHM0Q_NEYWxpHCwEdytfY6i9%2BRO2BebezzmenfQ_1c4u7zGrgg@mail.gmail.com> <CACcTwY=DcUREt5nJWo_eJfrB=3sQXBaS6nc%2B07fpZhxARD0zTQ@mail.gmail.com> <20150809215403.GC20238@server.rulingia.com>

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> On Aug 9, 2015, at 2:54 PM, Peter Jeremy <peter@rulingia.com> wrote:
>=20
> At this stage, it's not clear that SPARC has the critical mass of =
interest
> needed to ensure its ongoing viability.  Continuing to support an
> architecture incurs a non-zero cost to the Project as a whole so =
continuing
> to suppport SPARC needs to demonstrate a benefit to justify that cost.
>=20
> The costs include:
> - Whilst sparc64 remains tied to gcc4.2.1, FreeBSD as a whole can't =
take
> advantage of newer C constructs.

I can speak to that a bit=E2=80=A6  I went through a bit of a kerfuffle =
with the project when I was agitating to get libdispatch incorporated =
into base so that the project could have a decent multi-threading =
programming paradigm (with none of the perils of pthreads) at its core =
on which to build future async, multicore-aware applications.  That =
was=E2=80=99t just a pipe dream, either, as I watched that exact =
evolution occur (and continue) in OS X and iOS.  It=E2=80=99s tried and =
tested and it Just Works across a wider application base than any =
Unix-derived system to date has ever even contemplated, much less =
achieved.

However, the need to support non-blocks aware compilers basically killed =
the notion of pursuing that in the project.  Yes, you can use =
libdispatch without blocks, but it=E2=80=99s far less useful that way, =
and since my personal needs are more than met by the amd64 architecture, =
one that by any metric has become dominant in the industry, it was =
simply far more logical to pursue that work in a fork (again!) and I =
stopped agitating for it.

Now, should FreeBSD start insisting that clang support is mandatory to =
be a tier 1 architecture and that tier 2 architectures should build with =
external toolchains (on which they can also build with NO_FOO where FOO =
is any feature that requires clang) then perhaps that might be a good =
time to start thinking about bringing some of the OS X technologies back =
into the fold.  Until then, FreeBSD will of necessity be occupying a =
niche somewhere in-between the original FreeBSD, where we made a =
deliberate choice to focus on Intel and only Intel, and NetBSD.

- Jordan




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