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Date:      Wed, 31 Oct 2001 11:21:53 -0700
From:      Nate Williams <nate@yogotech.com>
To:        tlambert2@mindspring.com
Cc:        Nate Williams <nate@yogotech.com>, Chad David <davidc@acns.ab.ca>, John Baldwin <jhb@FreeBSD.ORG>, chat@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: time_t not to change size on x86
Message-ID:  <15328.16705.512452.136986@caddis.yogotech.com>
In-Reply-To: <3BE04036.D32ADF9@mindspring.com>
References:  <XFMail.011029134349.jhb@FreeBSD.org> <3BDE6ED3.64DC027E@mindspring.com> <15326.50508.909158.688936@caddis.yogotech.com> <3BDED2DC.A04B6822@mindspring.com> <20011030110629.A3499@colnta.acns.ab.ca> <3BDFBBB8.EE7E9482@mindspring.com> <15328.11596.96289.16985@caddis.yogotech.com> <3BE04036.D32ADF9@mindspring.com>

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> > In Java, you can not construct uninitialized objects.  You can do call
> > methods on objects, but these methods are 'static' methods, whose only
> > purpose is to allow you call methods that don't require an object to
> > work.
> > 
> > A good example of this in Math.sin(), which doesn't require any object
> > instantiated in order to perform the operation.
> > 
> > If you have classes that are not fully initialized, then it's an
> > implementation issue, which can be done just as easily (or badly) in C++
> > as it can be done in Java.
> 
> You've just made my point for me.  8-).  The language is supposed
> to be so much better than C++ because it protects you from the
> errors you can make in C++...

There's no way to keep people from doing stupid things if you want them
to do clever things.

If you want a completely safe language, try Logo. :)

You can't do anything with it, but it's also safe.

> > > I actually _like_ the GUI code; takes all kinds, I guess.  8-).
> > 
> > Our latest foray into Win32 + MFC has shown that Java is actually
> > *significantly* faster.  (We have two applications, the Java one, and
> > the win32/MFC application.  The Java app runs circles around the win32
> > app that implements the same functionality.  We dropped the Java
> > development because it didn't have a 'Windows Look and Feel'.)
> 
> Yes, that's very annoying, particularly since Microsoft takes
> great pains to publish style guides that, if followed, make
> your application totally indistinguishable from any other
> Microsoft application.  But of course, the marketing people
> absolutely hate that... they want the UI that looks like a cell
> phone on the screen, and which users can't use naturally by
> transferring the training they've had to the new app...  8-).

Actually, our marketing folks are the ones who wanted the Windows L&F
and killed the Java app.  (And, just because I work for Nokia doesn't
imply that the only products we have are related to cell phones. :)





Nate

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